Ilya Kovalchuk possibly finished in the NHL.

[WatchMyBreaks]

Pre LA Kings Stats:

816 Games Played
417 Goals
399 Assists
816 Points

03-04 Rocket Richard Winner
4 Gold Medals
3 Silver Medals
3 Bronze

2 KHL Championships including playoff MVP

Ilya Kovalchuk's career is criminally underrated and becoming more forgotten on a daily basis. The guy spent the better part of a decade on a pretty terrible team, got traded to a contender and almost immediately won a Stanley Cup. After being offered arguably the craziest contract in NHL history, Rick Dipietro not withstanding, he and Devils ownership decided to part ways. Saving the team a real headache with future cap recapture penalties being instated in the near future.

After spending seven of his prime seasons in the KHL and scoring nearly 150 goals he returned to the NHL for the LA Kings. Where he was quickly sent to fourth line/PP2 duty while putting up the following stat line on a lottery team:

64 GP 16 G 18 A 34 P

While its clear at 36 years old Kovalchuk is slowing down, he still can play at the NHL level. According to Kings GM Rob Blake, Kovalchuk and the team are mutually terminating the contract that has two years remaining. This situation could really be the end of Kovalchuk's NHL career as he's receiving KHL contract offers.

It may be hard to make the case for a HHOF selection, Kovalchuk was easily a top five player in the NHL during his first ten years. His name was firmly cemented with guys like Ovechkin, Crosby, Datsyuk, and Malkin for "best player in the world' from 2001-11.

 

[Boom Boom]

Another flashy Russian with a narrow band of offensive talent, but zero grit and zero heart. Great players make those around them better. He did not. He took as a player and didn't give. Hence less career assists than goals. Not a team leader at any point during his career. He does not deserve HOF consideration IMO.

 

[BlindThomen]

Another flashy Russian with a narrow band of offensive talent, but zero grit and zero heart. Great players make those around them better. He did not. He took as a player and didn't give. Hence less career assists than goals. Not a team leader at any point during his career. He does not deserve HOF consideration IMO.

I'm sorry, but lol at the zero grit and zero heart statement, and more goals than assists stating that a player is a taker, not a giver.

I'm also wondering how come no one mentioning "the greatness" the Kings starting from last season (including Doughty, Carter, Toffoli etc.)? But I guess there always has to be a scapegoat, and a well paid Russian is the easy target.

- Sauli

PS. I'm definitely not a Kovalchuk fan. Just think it's ridiculous to undermine a player because of their nationality. For example, there's been more than enough of players from North America coming to Europe thinking it's gonna be a walk in a park in the European leagues. Result? Contract terminated because of very poor results.

 

[Dallaz77]

Another flashy Russian with a narrow band of offensive talent, but zero grit and zero heart. Great players make those around them better. He did not. He took as a player and didn't give. Hence less career assists than goals. Not a team leader at any point during his career. He does not deserve HOF consideration IMO.

Well...there's also the fact that he is a left wing that just MIGHT account for the fact that he had a massive difference in goals to assists...yes, sarcasm.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

 

[Boom Boom]

I'm sorry, but lol at the zero grit and zero heart statement, and more goals than assists stating that a player is a taker, not a giver.

Look at his career stats. They speak for themselves. 538 penalty minutes in 897 games. A defensively void -152 for his career. Not one player in the top 50 all time had worse than -100. And not one player in the top 30 points all time list has fewer assists than goals. Again, great players make those around them better and contribute to team success in other ways than just scoring goals. Defensive play, working hard in the corners, assisting your teammates (all part of "heart and grit") are an important part of being a HOF worthy player.

 

[re-ac-tor]

And not one player in the top 30 points all time list has fewer assists than goals. .

Not sure what side of the argument I'm on, but Brett Hull had more goals than assists in his career. Mike Gartner, Mike Bossy and Ovi are other great players with more goals than assists.


My best,

ken

 

[TanguayFan]

Look at his career stats. They speak for themselves. 538 penalty minutes in 897 games. A defensively void -152 for his career. Not one player in the top 50 all time had worse than -100.

How many players in the top 50 all time played on a god awful expansion team for over half their career?

How many left in the prime of their career to play overseas?

 

[WatchMyBreaks]

Another flashy Russian with a narrow band of offensive talent, but zero grit and zero heart. Great players make those around them better. He did not. He took as a player and didn't give. Hence less career assists than goals. Not a team leader at any point during his career. He does not deserve HOF consideration IMO.

Good to see you're still keeping good spirits Mr. Cherry. Don't let the firing get you down.

 

[Craig2]

The HOF question is ridiculous, he's a lock.

Besides averaging almost a point-per-game over 800+ games, he's also top-15 in what's likely the second-best hockey league in the world. Add in a World Junior gold and silver, Olympic gold, and seven medals from the world championships including two gold, and it's an easy decision.

I know he's an easy target for those who question his heart, grit, intestinal fortitude, or whatever else Canadian commentators like to question of European players, but he's a guy who never missed many games and who always answered the bell for his country.

 

[geschrocks33]

Look at his career stats. They speak for themselves. 538 penalty minutes in 897 games. A defensively void -152 for his career. Not one player in the top 50 all time had worse than -100. And not one player in the top 30 points all time list has fewer assists than goals. Again, great players make those around them better and contribute to team success in other ways than just scoring goals. Defensive play, working hard in the corners, assisting your teammates (all part of "heart and grit") are an important part of being a HOF worthy player.

This is a serious hot take right here that some people have touched on and I'm gonna hit with some stats. You say no one in the Top 30 in points as fewer assists than goals, which is wrong. Hull (23rd) has more goals than assists. Also, Mike Gartner (31st) is 3 points outside the Top 30 and has more goals.

Also, the main person to consider is Ovechkin, who currently sits 39th in all time points, about 100 off of 30th, which I think we would expect him to rattle off during the remainder of his career.

Kovalchuk's +/- is horrible, but he hasn't exactly been playing on Cup contenders left and right, and starting on an expansion team didn't help his case.


And now for a comparison.

Kovalchuk:
436G, 423A, 859 Pts.

50.76% of his points are goals. Almost an even split.

Ovechkin:

671G, 563A, 1234 Pts.

54.38% of his points are goals. Over 100 extra goals than assists. You also bring up PIM's.

Kovalchuk: 538 PIM's in 897 Games (0.6 PIM per game)
Ovechkin: 699 PIM's in 1104 Games (0.63 PIM per game)


Are you going to question Ovechkin's "heart and grit" as you bring up? Because I highly doubt it. But the stats are almost the same, or "worse" for Ovi.

I'm not a Kovalchuk lover, but the points you are making are not the greatest comparisons.

 

[Boom Boom]

Hull (23rd) has more goals than assists. Also, Mike Gartner (31st) is 3 points outside the Top 30 and has more goals.

I stand corrected on Hull. However both he and Gartner have 700+ goals to make their HOF case.

Kovalchuk's +/- is horrible, but he hasn't exactly been playing on Cup contenders left and right, and starting on an expansion team didn't help his case.

This is an excuse. Ron Francis played on some pretty bad Whalers teams for a decade. Marcel Dionne is another example with horrible Red Wings and LA teams. Both are top 6 in all time points. These players started on terrible teams but were still able to perform far better than Kovalchuk.

Are you going to question Ovechkin's "heart and grit" as you bring up? Because I highly doubt it. But the stats are almost the same, or "worse" for Ovi.

We are talking about Kovalchuk not Ovechkin. It remains to be seen where he ends up.

 

[geschrocks33]

I stand corrected on Hull. However both he and Gartner have 700+ goals to make their HOF case.


We are talking about Kovalchuk not Ovechkin. It remains to be seen where he ends up.

Sure they both have 700 goals, and Hull leads the way in terms of scoring. However lets compare Gartner.

Gartner: 708G, 1432 GP = 0.494 Goals per Game
Kovalchuk: 436G, 897 GP = 0.486 Goals per Game


Almost identical. The point people are trying to make is that Kovalchuk during his times, was one of the best players in the league, and he stacks up statistically against other members of the HOF, and prolific goal scorers.


And yes, we're talking about Kovalchuk, not Ovechkin, but you made a comment directed at Russians with more career goals than assists. Then you added in the boatload of PIM's, and the comparison is there between Kovalchuk and Ovechkin.

 

[Boom Boom]

However lets compare Gartner.

Gartner: 708G, 1432 GP = 0.494 Goals per Game
Kovalchuk: 436G, 897 GP = 0.486 Goals per Game


Almost identical. The point people are trying to make is that Kovalchuk during his times, was one of the best players in the league, and he stacks up statistically against other members of the HOF, and prolific goal scorers.

There is no comparison between Kovalchuk and Mike Gartner if you factor in many other measurable stats and the immeasurable ones like grit, heart and leadership. If you're using the goals per game stat to argue that Kovalchuks HOF worthiness is comparable to Gartner then Tim Kerr, Rick Vaive and Blaine Stoughton should all be in the HOF as they had more GPG than Kovalchuk. Pierre Larouche has the same career GPG stats as Kovalchuk for that matter.

https://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/records/nhl-players-all-time-goals-per-game-leaders.html

And yes, we're talking about Kovalchuk, not Ovechkin, but you made a comment directed at Russians with more career goals than assists. .

No, I referred to Kovalchuk as a "flashy Russian with a narrow band of offensive talent".
He is, after all..... Russian. I don't see the plural in "Russian" and when I noted more career goals than assists I was referring to Kovalchuk, who this thread is about. Not Russians in general or Alex Ovechkin.

Hey, just let me say its great we have a board like this to share opinions on our favorite hockey topics. I respect your opinion on the matter, even if its different than mine. Cheers.

 

[odjickfan]

I remember when we were thrilled to hunt for Kovalchuk rookies in packs. Time goes by so quick!

 

[armedic1135]

I'll take all your Kovalchuk cards that you have if you're not a fan

Definitely underrated during his prime sniping years

I don't think he is HOF worthy, especially after leaving the NHL the way he did and lost who knows how many NHL goals and runs for the cup.

 

[hextall27]

Great discussion on the HOF probability. I think he really gave up on that when he left during his prime. He was on an Ovechkin-like pace before he left, but sort of sealed the deal on his legacy at that point.
It's too bad he was a great player.

 

[JohnnyDrama]

First and foremost: plus/minus is one of the most ridiculously skewed stats that there is. It has next to no value.

This is a good comparison but you also have to look at the game during their careers. Gartner (and guys like Mark Recchi, for that matter) benefited from a more open game. Kovalchuk played during the clutch-and-grab of the pre-lockout and a game that eased back into it post-lockout.

Sure they both have 700 goals, and Hull leads the way in terms of scoring. However lets compare Gartner.

Gartner: 708G, 1432 GP = 0.494 Goals per Game
Kovalchuk: 436G, 897 GP = 0.486 Goals per Game


Almost identical. The point people are trying to make is that Kovalchuk during his times, was one of the best players in the league, and he stacks up statistically against other members of the HOF, and prolific goal scorers.

 

[CeddieB]

I don't think he is HOF worthy, especially after leaving the NHL the way he did and lost who knows how many NHL goals and runs for the cup.

Although we should remember it is the "Hockey" Hall of Fame and not just the "NHL" Hall of Fame, so accomplishments at the Olympics, Worlds and KHL do count for something.

Not sure if I agree that he should be in, but I think as the passage of time after his retirement dulls some of these strong opinions as expressed in this thread, he will eventually get voted in.

 

[WatchMyBreaks]

Kovalchuk also has one of the highest goals per game averages in NHL history (top 50).

 

[golgo13]

I have to admit im pretty surprised this is even a debate. Kovy is HOF bound and there should be no questions about it. Hotlanta anyone???