Q
quincy
Guest
Never say never. Someone always gets to be first.
UD vs. Konami Lawsuit
- Thread starter meatmancgy
- Start date
Never say never. Someone always gets to be first.
Stadium Sports
Verified Trader,
True enough but it's never the deserving SOB's that it happens to.
That being said - what would the sportscard hobby be like without UD? Would it be better?
Would the car industry be better without Toyota?
I'm doubting it. Does Topp's come in and pick up the pieces (they are likely the only one's big enough to fill the void)? Or do we see how it works with less? I think if we work with less, prices would either skyrocket or collector numbers drop...
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bruinsman
Verified Trader
this is all crazy....how can we still continue to buy UD products not knowing if what we are getting is genuine.
im gonna sit on the sideline's for a bit.
im gonna sit on the sideline's for a bit.
frankiefives
Verified Trader,
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I miss Pacific. Many different Inserts and parallels in ALL products. Maybe this will actually be a GOOD thing for the hobby. Let's get back to collecting cards that don't cost hundreds of dollars. Cool looking inserts and parallels used to be HUGE hits. Boxes that cost over $60-$70 were called "high end". Let's go back to BUILDING sets that are actually "buildable" without mortgaging your house
I for one welcome a change to the hobby as a whole. I've busted high end for the last 4 years and suffered MASSIVE losses at times. Lately, I've cracked more low-end and made pretty good profit. That tells me something...
steen101984
Verified Trader
Im not so sure about that. While there definitely is the possibility that this will cause huge problems there is also the possibility that this is exactly whats needed and may potentially blow life into the hobby. If there is less high end stuff and more lower tier products it becomes more accesible for more people.
pssteve
New Member, Must Send First
Wow I sure am glad I avoided the redemption laden Artifacts. Might as well burn any redemptions you get in SPX or SPA.
Sure wouldn't want to be a dealer who has to send front money to UD directly for SPA or CUP. Could just be flushing it in the toilet.
Guess the court will clarify this more on Jan 26th. Those in LA may want to drop by Spring St. Federal Ct. Rm 9. Time not posted yet.
Sure wouldn't want to be a dealer who has to send front money to UD directly for SPA or CUP. Could just be flushing it in the toilet.
Guess the court will clarify this more on Jan 26th. Those in LA may want to drop by Spring St. Federal Ct. Rm 9. Time not posted yet.
richie.rocket.cards
Verified Trader,
While I welcome change, inclusion of other sets, ideas, reversion to fewer high end products, etc, I'd be really sad to see Upper Deck go. I've collected their wonderful cards for all my collecting days. Nobody in my opinion has been more innovative than Upper Deck when it comes to hockey cards.
Triple B
Verified Trader,
If UD stays, this hobby will suffer serious setbacks. They may have innovated the hobby at the turn of the 80s, but they've damaged it quite extensively over the last few. As I said, I hope the good people who work there find work quickly, but beyond that, I won't be upset to see UD reap what they've sewn.
Kharlamov17
Verified Trader
Let the good times roll, even if I still think UD will manage to handle this in some odd way.
An US Company versus a Japanese one. I have my doubts.
An US Company versus a Japanese one. I have my doubts.
Q
quincy
Guest
Corporate Kumite is always good clean fun for those on the sidelines.
I'm not prepared to write UD off completely at this point, simply because egregious guilt or not there's nothing to be gained by the courts or Konami in having UD terminated.
As regards stepping backwards in the hobby...I have my doubts. The genie of bigger-shinier-flashier is out of the bottle, and has been for over a decade now. He ain't going back in. And even if UD falters and fails, there remains other competitors willing to hold that torch (to our wallets) high.
I'm not prepared to write UD off completely at this point, simply because egregious guilt or not there's nothing to be gained by the courts or Konami in having UD terminated.
As regards stepping backwards in the hobby...I have my doubts. The genie of bigger-shinier-flashier is out of the bottle, and has been for over a decade now. He ain't going back in. And even if UD falters and fails, there remains other competitors willing to hold that torch (to our wallets) high.
weasel-king
Registered Trader,
Why are so many people hoping UD completely fails? Despite the photoshoot jerseys, name mixups, redemption woes, etc., this hobby would still be in the dark ages without them (maybe not a bad thing based on all the other "let's get back to the good ol' days" threads).
Look, a company with as much money as UD will not go under for printing some unauthorized cards. If they didn't get in more trouble for bad authentication and all the other things in the past then they will weather this storm as well.
Burning redemption cards, major setbacks--it's a little too soon to start blowing the trumpets and for the earth to open up and swallow the hobby whole.
Look, a company with as much money as UD will not go under for printing some unauthorized cards. If they didn't get in more trouble for bad authentication and all the other things in the past then they will weather this storm as well.
Burning redemption cards, major setbacks--it's a little too soon to start blowing the trumpets and for the earth to open up and swallow the hobby whole.
meatmancgy
Verified Trader ,
What will be interesting is if McW is named personally liable for this or not, as it's a civil suit, likely not. This means that Konami is suing ONE of Upper Deck's companies, likely Upper Deck LLC; and we all know McW is smart enough to be running several if not many different companies - that's just smart business. What I mean is, the main corporation is likely the LLC, but he has other UD companies that work out of those offices - UD Authentic, which controls & sells all the authentic (?) game-used stuff & pictures (and likely is the company that owns the memorabilia that gets "sold" to UD LLC for inclusion into the cards) and likely a company that owns the building in Carlsbad. I dare say there's another 3-7 companies that operate specific divisions within the overall company. And if he sets his companies up like most, he will be the sole shareholder rather than the LLC owning sub-companies, so the lawsuit may not be able to touch his personal assets (LLC = Limited Liability Company - means the shareholders are insulated from liability). It really depends on the agreement between UD & Konami, and whether personal guarantees were included in the contract.
At the end of the day, UD will likely close up UD LLC and re-organize as UD 2010 LLC or something similar. We haven't seen the end of UD, and maybe that's not a bad thing - perhaps this outcome will finally make McW see that operating as a legitimate, legal business CAN be done.
At the end of the day, UD will likely close up UD LLC and re-organize as UD 2010 LLC or something similar. We haven't seen the end of UD, and maybe that's not a bad thing - perhaps this outcome will finally make McW see that operating as a legitimate, legal business CAN be done.
The Great Zo
Verified Trader,
Even for those (like me) who are sick and tired of Upper Deck's blundering of the hockey exclusive, their complete exit from the market is not in the best interests in the hobby. Another large company (and it won't be ITG) will get the license immediately. The NHLPA isn't going to let that licensing revenue sit un-contracted. I'd guess that the collector-oriented people like myself will find plenty to dislike about recent Topps or DLP sets as well (although maybe they at least have a better handle on whose jersey pieces belong to who).
DXFlyers
Registered Trader
Panini will probably be the best option for the hockey hobby. It will be up to the NHLPA (they are more disfunctional now than ever) if ITG gets back literally in the game.
pssteve
New Member, Must Send First
Dead on Bruce. Only quibble is that McWm has 2-3 major silent partners who figure in this mess and who could confuse the matter.
cards-gotta-go
Banned User
I'll keep buying lottery tickets thanks... the odds are better on the 649.
cassijon
Verified Trader / Prior Infraction On File,
wrong. panini will not be the best option. their products put the oooooo in OOOOOOGLY.
meatmancgy
Verified Trader ,
Panini is going to struggle to get their money back on basketball - adding another exclusive would be difficult at best. Topps has their hands full with the baseball exclusive & their regular football license; doubt they would want an exclusive on hockey too.
Bruce,
Topps is losing football at the end of this season - the only license of the big 4 sports that they will have will be baseball. Panini has basketball and football, and UD as will have hockey, football and a MLBPA license.
meatmancgy
Verified Trader ,
NFL made a decision on the licenses already? I didn't hear that. That changes the landscape dramatically. If Topps comes back in because of this Konami issue with UD, they better get more creative in their hockey attempts than they have been with their baseball ones.
