Leaf Exclusive Nico Hischier

[JonX]

i for one dont like exclusives but certainly not blaming leaf as upper deck started this whole exclusive thing years ago.

they still have exclusives with jordan and lebron and they dont even make basketball cards anymore.

i personnally never understood the "oh theres no logo the card isnt good thing'", i collect habs and expos cards, and never stopped myself form getting a card cause i didnt see the team logo,. panini makes some great unlicensed baseball cards as do leaf with hockey. for me if youre a real fan of the team who cares if theres a logo, in a perfect world there would be one and there would be 4-5 companies making licenced cards. i dont collect devils or flyers so this exclusive doenst bother me, but i did collect them would certainly buy the leaf cards without hesitation

 

[LeafCeo]

The only thing UD considers is who is next on their list to sign before you do. Than you do it to them, and they do you, and on and on and on.

The winner is who has deeper pockets to sign the most wanted signatures.



The collectors are the ones who lose here no matter who signs who to an exclusive. In order to keep signing exclusives and make it worth while, you need to recoup that cost. The only way to do that is mark up your product, which most I find too much to spend money on (again both UD and Leaf).

Seems in the past couple of years the only thing either company cares about is tossing out whatever they can to get the group breakers happy. 99% of everything released has lacked design, thought, QA, and majority of customers in mind.



This "I have bigger balls than you" attitude (from both UD and Leaf) is getting old and driving people away from current product, and out of the hobby all together. Pull people in with innovation, design, and what collectors want. You can put a Crosby or Eichel signature on a turd, I still won't buy it. Put it on a card that looks nice, and has some originality on it, than you got me thinking "hmmm dam thats a nice looking card".

I don't disagree.
Let's stop exclusives today..

UD ready?


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[SLanding]

I feel bad for the true collectors. For those true collectors you are the children of a bad divorce getting caught in the middle of 2 forces who don't give a hoot about you.

UD doesn't care cause they didn't sign up these guys when they know other companies will and Leaf doesn't as they are trying to use your anger of exclusives and signing these picks as some kind of lightning rod against favoring UD.

If I collected these players I would never support a company that knowingly went out of their way to undermine the collector.

Both sides are wrong and both are too stubborn to correct it and it's the collectors that are hurt.

Well done Leaf and UD.

 

[bamlinden]

As a guy that has been collecting for decades, the ebbs and flows of an ever-changing landscape in the hobby world is nothing new. We all know that the hobby exploded in the early 90's and we all know that companies have held exclusives and others have produced products without the ability to put logos on cards. I'm sure in another 10...20 years we will be looking at yet another landscape that will be different than the one in front of us today.

I can appreciate that a company like Leaf (and Presidents Choice) will put themselves out there on the hobby boards and create a good deal of transparency that just did not exist 20...30 years ago. I may not agree with everything they say or do - and that's perfectly alright. They can run their businesses as they see fit and I can support them or not with my wallet.

That's the beauty of this hobby......I am the one who gets to choose how to spend my money. There are so many choice out there that it's become quite easy for me to find something in my wheelhouse in order to keep things interesting and fun.

I'm not a fan of the exclusives thing but I totally get why they exist at this time. Here's hoping that in 20...30 years the need to discuss it won't be there.

 

[lucscaps]

I keep reading "collect what you like".

It's been said on this thread many times over.

Only thing is Leaf is taking away what I like to collect. They are forcefully taking away what I like.

It's that simple.

I appreciated their efforts before but now all I see is a company that is forcefully taking something away from what I would like to collect.

I don't want to collect what they can produce.

I

 

[Elias Devil]

The "motive" as you describe it is to not deprive collectors of a chance to own these cards signed. Another point that goes to my sincerity in this whole process.



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But you're literally depriving people, in this case Devils fans, of autograph cards of a player they want to collect.

Cut the sincerity stuff. You had a chance to come here and be sincere and say "Yea, we are signing these exclusives because we believe it will better position our company for the future." But instead you talk about giving collectors options, when in reality you're depriving them of NHL autograph cards, and continue using the "but UD is doing it too" lines. I really don't mean to come off as rude but you guys need better PR counseling because a lot of the excuses from you guys are just shooting yourselves in the foot even more.

 

[bamlinden]

Decided to delete my post.

 

[Bossy22]

But you're literally depriving people, in this case Devils fans, of autograph cards of a player they want to collect.

Cut the sincerity stuff. You had a chance to come here and be sincere and say "Yea, we are signing these exclusives because we believe it will better position our company for the future." But instead you talk about giving collectors options, when in reality you're depriving them of NHL autograph cards, and continue using the "but UD is doing it too" lines. I really don't mean to come off as rude but you guys need better PR counseling because a lot of the excuses from you guys are just shooting yourselves in the foot even more.

I think being a devils fan you can not see objectively. If the Isles had just drafted Tavares and Leaf signed him to an exclusive I would not be able to see objectively either. As a fan of hockey cards who has become tired of ud and their products and desires change in the industry I am ecstatic with what Leaf is doing. For me it is at least making ud think about their products as they will be without the top 2 rcs in the autographed sets! At best it let's the powers that be know that all is not right and they need to rethink the whole exclusive thing!!!

 

[MNwild10]

I don't think anyone will be rethinking any exclusives. It's going to exist forever. What I see happening more (if allowed) is an increase in prospecting to get one up on the "other guy". Meaning, what 14/15 year old can we sign to an exclusive in the hopes they are the next big thing when they're draft age eligible. But this is a great example of why I've moved on to baseball, and older baseball at that. I won't have to worry about it.

Derek K.

 

[ChuckNorrisFearsSid]

I doubt this will cause UD to do anything other than throw more money at the prospects. Looks like next year's SPA will be down to one auto per box and some other "bounty" program no one has interest in. Lol.

 

[NJDEVILS30]

The "motive" as you describe it is to not deprive collectors of a chance to own these cards signed. Another point that goes to my sincerity in this whole process.



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Thanks very much for your reply - one thing is for certain, your dedication to this discussion and visibility on the forums definitely makes a huge difference for collectors - kudos for that!

Another thing I have noticed is that the cost of having a card signed by Eichel via the private signing route was astronomical:

"For those opting to take the autographed sticker route, the cost is $75.00 each (including return shipping) and the sticker will be applied to their card upon receipt. Those that would prefer to wait for a hard-signed autograph (expected to be in the next 60 to 90 days at most) will pay $105.00 each. In either case, Leaf must affix an Leaf Authentics label to the back of the cards."

For a collector in Canada, tracked shipping to you in the USA is about $20, and the sticker autograph was running about $101 CAD. I'm not sure why anyone would send a card in for a sticker autograph, so skip ahead to the hard-signed option... $105 USD is just north of $140 CAD.

Can you give some insight into why you would charge double what I paid at a Brodeur in person signing which included a brief meet and greet and photo op for a mail-in Eichel?

If the goal was really to give collectors an opportunity to have their miscellaneous item signed by Eichel, why not make the process and the player more accessible/affordable? How about a public signing in the Buffalo area, for example?

 

[charnick]

I keep reading "collect what you like".

It's been said on this thread many times over.

Only thing is Leaf is taking away what I like to collect. They are forcefully taking away what I like.

It's that simple.

I appreciated their efforts before but now all I see is a company that is forcefully taking something away from what I would like to collect.

I don't want to collect what they can produce.

I

Do you mind if I ask you something then, and please don't take offense, I mean none, just trying to understand. What exactly is it that you like to collect? Is it just "licensed" rookies, because if so, these guys will still have those... is it licensed autographed rookies? Because again if so, do you get upset when a 4th liner who sits in the press box for half the season or shuttles back and forth to the AHL doesn't get a YG or RPA at all? That's also a licensed autographed rookie card that doesn't get made at all, albeit for a different reason. Do you feel your collection is missing something because 1992-93 UD didn't have autographed rookies?

My point is this: sounds like you've (and I guess the general term, not necessarily you specifically) gotten spoiled by all the autographed cards that have been permeating the landscape for what 10-15 years now. We're not entitled to them, certainly not every since rookie that shows up, and it stinks when someone gives you something (auto'ed "true" RC's)and then tries to take it away. There is certainly still plenty to collect if so, and as I once mentioned, it's not like you missed out on something someone else has. If there's an Cup RPA /99 that someone everyone else gets, but you miss out on and another never (or super rarely) shows up, do you get upset about the gap in your collection because you missed out? I'd be more upset about the fact that UD only gives 99 people the chance to get one of those, than Leaf somehow "forcefully" taking away something you like. If you don't want to collect what they produce, that's entirely on you, not on them! Either reexamine why you collect what you do, or refocus what you collect across company lines. The card companies are in it to make money, and make money ONLY, not to make collectors happy. We should all know that by now.

It's frustrating certainly, but I posit that it's not because you're (again, generally speaking) being deprived of the actual cards, but because, as another poster mentioned, you're being deprived of a card that could potentially rise significantly in value that you could one day make some money on, rather than because you truly enjoy collecting them. If that were the case, where's the outcry for the lack of Matt Grzelcyk, Danny O'Regan and Evan Rodrigues autographed cards?

I also agree with the poster than mentioned that a couple of you who are Devils and Flyers fans are too close to the situation to see it clearly, and to you guys I agree that it sucks to not be able to chase your top picks, but please keep in mind, UD is actually a WORSE company at this game, as they have been depriving Chicago Bulls and Cleveland Cavaliers fans of licensed autographed cards of Michael Jordan and LeBron James for YEARS now. HOw do you think those collectors feel, considering they're not two as-of-now undrafted prospects but the 2 GOAT's in the NBA! How awful is that for those collectors?

Lastly, what if by some strange happenstance both of these guys slip and go 3-4 instead of 1-2, and become Puljujarvi instead of McDavid in collecting terms. Devils and Flyers collectors will rejoice that they will get their shiny new auto'ed rookies, but in fact has the situation actually really changed at all?

Again, no disrespect, honestly, just trying to understand your position, because from my POV, your post (and this time I do mean you specifically) certainly reads like you think you're entitled to these non-existent cards, if only just because you've had access to them so much in the past. What if UD had so much financial trouble that they stopped producing autos altogether because they couldn't afford to pay the players anymore? What would you do then?

 

[charnick]

Can you give some insight into why you would charge double what I paid at a Brodeur in person signing which included a brief meet and greet and photo op for a mail-in Eichel?

Brian can probably chime in best on that, but I'd figure the private answer would be because people will pay it. I know I did, for 2 on-card autos, and yes the price was high, but he's the new kid on the block and Brodeur's been around since Matteau, Matteau, Matteau. (Sorry, had to do it, since it was just the anniversary a couple days ago). You know rookies rule all... I mean, you don't ask why do Thatcher Demko rookie autos go for more than Brodeur's? Just an example, I didn't actually check but you get my point.

If the goal was really to give collectors an opportunity to have their miscellaneous item signed by Eichel, why not make the process and the player more accessible/affordable? How about a public signing in the Buffalo area, for example?

IIRC, the exclusive doesn't include memorabilia, and Eichel has done signings in the past for D&A Card World which is in the Buffalo area. And even though the price might have been a little outrageous, the accessibility was certainly there... way more accessible than UD has been with their hockey exclusives, in my opinion.

Though I think it's a great idea that they use these exclusives the best they can, and if the can arrange a public signing in NJ or Philly for these new guys, I think that would be awesome, and would be better than much of the UDA autograph memorabilia that they sell direct for insanely high prices.

 

[SLanding]

Do you mind if I ask you something then, and please don't take offense, I mean none, just trying to understand. What exactly is it that you like to collect? Is it just "licensed" rookies, because if so, these guys will still have those... is it licensed autographed rookies? Because again if so, do you get upset when a 4th liner who sits in the press box for half the season or shuttles back and forth to the AHL doesn't get a YG or RPA at all? That's also a licensed autographed rookie card that doesn't get made at all, albeit for a different reason. Do you feel your collection is missing something because 1992-93 UD didn't have autographed rookies?

My point is this: sounds like you've (and I guess the general term, not necessarily you specifically) gotten spoiled by all the autographed cards that have been permeating the landscape for what 10-15 years now. We're not entitled to them, certainly not every since rookie that shows up, and it stinks when someone gives you something (auto'ed "true" RC's)and then tries to take it away. There is certainly still plenty to collect if so, and as I once mentioned, it's not like you missed out on something someone else has. If there's an Cup RPA /99 that someone everyone else gets, but you miss out on and another never (or super rarely) shows up, do you get upset about the gap in your collection because you missed out? I'd be more upset about the fact that UD only gives 99 people the chance to get one of those, than Leaf somehow "forcefully" taking away something you like. If you don't want to collect what they produce, that's entirely on you, not on them! Either reexamine why you collect what you do, or refocus what you collect across company lines. The card companies are in it to make money, and make money ONLY, not to make collectors happy. We should all know that by now.

It's frustrating certainly, but I posit that it's not because you're (again, generally speaking) being deprived of the actual cards, but because, as another poster mentioned, you're being deprived of a card that could potentially rise significantly in value that you could one day make some money on, rather than because you truly enjoy collecting them. If that were the case, where's the outcry for the lack of Matt Grzelcyk, Danny O'Regan and Evan Rodrigues autographed cards?

I also agree with the poster than mentioned that a couple of you who are Devils and Flyers fans are too close to the situation to see it clearly, and to you guys I agree that it sucks to not be able to chase your top picks, but please keep in mind, UD is actually a WORSE company at this game, as they have been depriving Chicago Bulls and Cleveland Cavaliers fans of licensed autographed cards of Michael Jordan and LeBron James for YEARS now. HOw do you think those collectors feel, considering they're not two as-of-now undrafted prospects but the 2 GOAT's in the NBA! How awful is that for those collectors?

Lastly, what if by some strange happenstance both of these guys slip and go 3-4 instead of 1-2, and become Puljujarvi instead of McDavid in collecting terms. Devils and Flyers collectors will rejoice that they will get their shiny new auto'ed rookies, but in fact has the situation actually really changed at all?

Again, no disrespect, honestly, just trying to understand your position, because from my POV, your post (and this time I do mean you specifically) certainly reads like you think you're entitled to these non-existent cards, if only just because you've had access to them so much in the past. What if UD had so much financial trouble that they stopped producing autos altogether because they couldn't afford to pay the players anymore? What would you do then?

The entitlement you are speaking of is the expectation from the collector's point of view that for the last 10-15 years or even longer the top rookies always have had licensed autos SPA, Cup, etc, etc. Now starting with Eichel collectors of these teams are getting shafted.

Are collectors entitled to a licensed auto of their teams top draft pick? Maybe, maybe not but the history is there and both companies don't seem to care and it's the collector caught in the middle.

I respect Brian Price a whole lot more now as he never put the collectors in a spot to choose between his unlicensed product and their wishes to add a licensed auto card of that teams top prospect. All Leaf is doing is trying to push the NHLPA into giving them a spot at the table and using the collector as a pawn in this battle.

 

[LGBuffalo]

But you're literally depriving people, in this case Devils fans, of autograph cards of a player they want to collect.

Cut the sincerity stuff. You had a chance to come here and be sincere and say "Yea, we are signing these exclusives because we believe it will better position our company for the future." But instead you talk about giving collectors options, when in reality you're depriving them of NHL autograph cards, and continue using the "but UD is doing it too" lines. I really don't mean to come off as rude but you guys need better PR counseling because a lot of the excuses from you guys are just shooting yourselves in the foot even more.

I can understand your frustration in this situation. I am a Sabres fan, and it was different opening UD products and having no Eichel autographs. However, I am still able to get them through Leaf, and that's a choice I don't mind making. That's just it, it's a choice.

Leaf isn't wrong when they say there are options. There are. You can choose to buy a Patrick or Hischier autograph, or not, but in the end, it's still a choice. It's not that exclusives are necessarily bad for the hobby, they're bad for certain hobbyists and their preferences. Would I like to have an Eichel autograph from the Cup? Sure. But I can't. If having either of those player's autographs in your collection is that important, you'll have one. If them having to be licensed is more important, then your collection will remain "unfettered". Either way, it's just a hobby, and at the end of the day, we have to make peace with our choices and take joy in what we collect.

Just my two cents, and please understand, it's not an attack on you, I've seen this come up before and thought I'd weigh in.

 

[charnick]

I can understand your frustration in this situation. I am a Sabres fan, and it was different opening UD products and having no Eichel autographs. However, I am still able to get them through Leaf, and that's a choice I don't mind making. That's just it, it's a choice.

Leaf isn't wrong when they say there are options. There are. You can choose to buy a Patrick or Hischier autograph, or not, but in the end, it's still a choice. It's not that exclusives are necessarily bad for the hobby, they're bad for certain hobbyists and their preferences. Would I like to have an Eichel autograph from the Cup? Sure. But I can't. If having either of those player's autographs in your collection is that important, you'll have one. If them having to be licensed is more important, then your collection will remain "unfettered". Either way, it's just a hobby, and at the end of the day, we have to make peace with our choices and take joy in what we collect.

Just my two cents, and please understand, it's not an attack on you, I've seen this come up before and thought I'd weigh in.

My sentiments exactly, I was just more verbose in my response! And if it's the actual autograph ink that matters most, you can still get your Eichel Cup RP signed if Leaf is still having their private signing with Eichel (dunno if this is the case... BG?). But if it's not pack-pulled and you don't think of it as a true auto'ed card, again, that's on the collector, not the companies!

And again, isn't it UD's fault that the best RC's are only /99 to being with? What if you're #100 and don't get an Eichel Cup RP at all? Who's depriving you now?

 

[NJDEVILS30]

Brian can probably chime in best on that, but I'd figure the private answer would be because people will pay it. I know I did, for 2 on-card autos, and yes the price was high, but he's the new kid on the block and Brodeur's been around since Matteau, Matteau, Matteau. (Sorry, had to do it, since it was just the anniversary a couple days ago). You know rookies rule all... I mean, you don't ask why do Thatcher Demko rookie autos go for more than Brodeur's? Just an example, I didn't actually check but you get my point.

IIRC, the exclusive doesn't include memorabilia, and Eichel has done signings in the past for D&A Card World which is in the Buffalo area. And even though the price might have been a little outrageous, the accessibility was certainly there... way more accessible than UD has been with their hockey exclusives, in my opinion.

Though I think it's a great idea that they use these exclusives the best they can, and if the can arrange a public signing in NJ or Philly for these new guys, I think that would be awesome, and would be better than much of the UDA autograph memorabilia that they sell direct for insanely high prices.

I question the first part of your reply in that people will pay exorbitant amounts for the opportunity to have UD items signed by Eichel, as the market simply doesn't back that up. It does make complete sense to me that someone heavily invested in Eichel, and more specifically Leaf Eichel cards would defend the value of their products.

I saw two completed listings for Eichel signed YGs, one for $75, and one for $80 USD - both far below the price charged for the autograph alone - the young guns card itself being worth at least $40.

For the same $105, you could purchase at least three, probably 4 low-numbered Leaf Eichel autographs from various products. If the value of a Leaf branded Eichel autograph on the open market is $30 or so, why turn around and nearly quadruple the cost for a privately signed item? If this private signing option was truly about the customer/collector and giving them an opportunity, why price people out in such a way?

Eichel was a very highly touted prospect, and generated a huge amount of buzz - while I disagree, consensus in this thread seems to be that both of this year's top two picks will be marginal NHL players and won't have nearly the impact that Eichel has had in Buffalo.

My question is this - Why bother even signing these guys to exclusives? If Eichel hasn't helped your brand, what makes you think that these lesser talents will increase Leaf's popularity? This is a lose-lose situation, as the collector does not benefit from unlicensed, often uninspired cards being released followed up with private signings that vastly exaggerate the value of the product, and the brand doesn't make any gains, either.

Would you mind posting your Leaf Eichel collection in S&T? I for one would love to see it, and I'm sure that it would give the folks at Leaf a thrill as well.

 

[piper1]

But you're literally depriving people, in this case Devils fans, of autograph cards of a player they want to collect.

Cut the sincerity stuff. You had a chance to come here and be sincere and say "Yea, we are signing these exclusives because we believe it will better position our company for the future." But instead you talk about giving collectors options, when in reality you're depriving them of NHL autograph cards, and continue using the "but UD is doing it too" lines. I really don't mean to come off as rude but you guys need better PR counseling because a lot of the excuses from you guys are just shooting yourselves in the foot even more.

Now you won't be able to dispay it alongside your Autographed Martin Brodeur
Rookie card. We all feel your pain. :speechless:

 

[lucscaps]

I'm just going to put this out there but this post to me is garbage.

I'll answer your questions as I see them:

Do you mind if I ask you something then, and please don't take offense, I mean none, just trying to understand. What exactly is it that you like to collect?

I collect certain cards of Devils players that feature them in a Devils uniform from sets that I like. I like to see the logo and nice picture of the player

Is it just "licensed" rookies, because if so, these guys will still have those... is it licensed autographed rookies?

I will continue to collect the yg and sp gu rc's because they will show a picture of the player with the devils logo on them.

Because again if so, do you get upset when a 4th liner who sits in the press box for half the season or shuttles back and forth to the AHL doesn't get a YG or RPA at all?

Yes infact I do get upset, I was upset when John Quenneville didn't get a YG, I consider this the go to rc. You can look it up in the SPa thread. I wrote that in there. I'd love all the rc's to have a auto'd SPA rc. That's my favorite auto rc set, it's a clean and attainable release.

That's also a licensed autographed rookie card that doesn't get made at all, albeit for a different reason. Do you feel your collection is missing something because 1992-93 UD didn't have autographed rookies?

YG's and auto'd rc's weren't available at that time so this is not valid but they are available now so I'd like to be able to collect them as I see fit


My point is this: sounds like you've (and I guess the general term, not necessarily you specifically) gotten spoiled by all the autographed cards that have been permeating the landscape for what 10-15 years now. We're not entitled to them, certainly not every since rookie that shows up, and it stinks when someone gives you something (auto'ed "true" RC's)and then tries to take it away.

This garbage to me. This statement is complete garbage. Why are you saying that we are spoiled? This makes no sense to me. The hobby evolved that way. It is not changing, the fact is a certain company is taking away something with the purpose of hurting the collector and another company. They are not shying away from this. It is the main objective. It's like McDonalds came in and purchased all the land that was used to grow Tim Horton's coffee beans and said sorry, but you can't have them anymore. Tims coffee drinkers would not have that freedom of choice anymore.


There is certainly still plenty to collect if so, and as I once mentioned, it's not like you missed out on something someone else has. If there's an Cup RPA /99 that someone everyone else gets, but you miss out on and another never (or super rarely) shows up, do you get upset about the gap in your collection because you missed out? I'd be more upset about the fact that UD only gives 99 people the chance to get one of those, than Leaf somehow "forcefully" taking away something you like. If you don't want to collect what they produce, that's entirely on you, not on them! Either reexamine why you collect what you do, or refocus what you collect across company lines. The card companies are in it to make money, and make money ONLY, not to make collectors happy. We should all know that by now.

Again more garbage, specially the bolded statement. There are 99 copies of the card, everyone knows that going in. It's no secret. If you don't hit one in your case then yeah it sucks but ultimately a collector will go on the secondary market and get one if they need it. How could anyone be more upset about that then Leaf taking the possibility of the card away? This makes no sense.


It's frustrating certainly, but I posit that it's not because you're (again, generally speaking) being deprived of the actual cards, but because, as another poster mentioned, you're being deprived of a card that could potentially rise significantly in value that you could one day make some money on, rather than because you truly enjoy collecting them. If that were the case, where's the outcry for the lack of Matt Grzelcyk, Danny O'Regan and Evan Rodrigues autographed cards?

Again, I could care less about the card rising in value. I'm not after that. I'm after cards that I like. This has nothing to do with that and I have no once said anything about something rising in value. And I have asked for lesser players to have more content. I enjoy collecting Devils players as there are those that enjoy the Flyers and the Sabres. Who of them are saying awesome, I get airbrushed pictures of these players.

I also agree with the poster than mentioned that a couple of you who are Devils and Flyers fans are too close to the situation to see it clearly, and to you guys I agree that it sucks to not be able to chase your top picks, but please keep in mind, UD is actually a WORSE company at this game, as they have been depriving Chicago Bulls and Cleveland Cavaliers fans of licensed autographed cards of Michael Jordan and LeBron James for YEARS now. HOw do you think those collectors feel, considering they're not two as-of-now undrafted prospects but the 2 GOAT's in the NBA! How awful is that for those collectors?

Yes we are to close, but what is stopping Leaf from doing with Patrick, Hirscher and Eichel what UD is doing with Jordan and Lebron. They effectively are. I don't see this as different.

Lastly, what if by some strange happenstance both of these guys slip and go 3-4 instead of 1-2, and become Puljujarvi instead of McDavid in collecting terms. Devils and Flyers collectors will rejoice that they will get their shiny new auto'ed rookies, but in fact has the situation actually really changed at all?

If Patrick and Hirsher slip and go 3 and 4 then I would still be upset, only I would be upset for those collectors who it affects.

Again, no disrespect, honestly, just trying to understand your position, because from my POV, your post (and this time I do mean you specifically) certainly reads like you think you're entitled to these non-existent cards, if only just because you've had access to them so much in the past. What if UD had so much financial trouble that they stopped producing autos altogether because they couldn't afford to pay the players anymore? What would you do then?

I do take disrespect to this, you are implying that I shouldn't collect what I like to collect in my eyes. I have brand loyalty, product loyalty. I like certain types of cards just like I like a certain brand of coffee in the morning. I like a certain kind of protein in my shake after the gym. If UD couldn't produce auto's anymore because of something they did, or Tim's couldn't make my coffee because of something they did then it would suck, but I would move on and find something different. When an outside force comes in and blocks what I like then that's a different story.

 

[SLanding]

Now you won't be able to dispay it alongside your Autographed Martin Brodeur
Rookie card. We all feel your pain. :speechless:

Once again people with argument are missing the point. When Brodeur had a rookie there weren't rookie autos of any players. Rookie autos are the norm now thus having that option of a licensed rookie auto taken away from a collector is the main issue here. Understand now?