And why should i support my local LCS

I understand the arguments in favour of buying from your LCS. And over the years I enjoyed buying from LCS as well. But the bottom line is money. I will always buy where I can get the best deal and save the most money. Sure the comradery and personal service is nice, but I would still continue to buy 99% of my cards from ebay and some other online websites. Like most people, I have bills to pay, a family and other expenses, so I can't afford to do the LCS a favour and help him stay in business if his prices are too high. It's simple economics - the best or cheapest prices gets the sale, and most often this is from ebay.
 
I purchase certain items at my local card shop but the selection isn't that vast.

I also don't consider an LCS as the lifeblood of the hobby or the place where I interact with other collectors. I feel that was the case 10+ years ago. I just don't have the time to go to an LCS during normal working hours.

I now use online forums, blogs, etc. to interact with other collectors. They're my life blood now. And I can access them 24/7.
 
I understand the arguments in favour of buying from your LCS. And over the years I enjoyed buying from LCS as well. But the bottom line is money. I will always buy where I can get the best deal and save the most money. Sure the comradery and personal service is nice, but I would still continue to buy 99% of my cards from ebay and some other online websites. Like most people, I have bills to pay, a family and other expenses, so I can't afford to do the LCS a favour and help him stay in business if his prices are too high. It's simple economics - the best or cheapest prices gets the sale, and most often this is from ebay.

It's your money and your hobby - you should do whatever is economical and enjoyable for you. It's a global marketplace.
If it's cheaper on eBay (as in really cheaper = price + shipping + time), then you should buy it there. We are not asking you to do us a favour.

The only time the "eBay" statement bothers me is when someone tells me they can buy a product that we are selling for $90 (taxes included = all in) and they advise us it's offered for $80 on eBay and want us to adjust our pricing. When we go look it and find its $79.99 + $9.99 shipping.

This even worse for the guys buying singles.. "I can buy that card for 29 cents on ebay". Seriously??? Did you forget that $2.99 shipping? Maybe that $1.00 I want for it is not that bad after all???

And this statement will sound like some "preaching from the soap box" but one thing you will never get from eBay is the friendships and interactions you get in a LCS. We had our 25th anniversary last Tuesday and the place was packed with some of the greatest friends and collectors I know. Some bought a bunch of product that night and some did not buy any as it was mid-week but one thing they all did get was a fun great time. A LCS is like a bar without the beer or obnoxious drunks (although some of the hockey talk gets heated... LOL). It is about fun and enjoyment of the hobby. Just like this site is about the enjoyment of the hobby.

Back on point. We offered ITG Game Used at preorder at $128. The shelf price is $146 based on a 30% markup. The point of that statement is something I have said on here and the other forums likely a 1000 times. Develop a relationship with your LCS and find out the savings you can obtain at preorder. You can often find it equal or cheaper than ebay.

Although my math is not what it used to be - there is more than a $200 savings on the case.

One of the things that used to be evident on eBay was the case breakers selling off the remaining boxes in a case once they hit the case hit. They would dump them at $10 - $15 under what a LCS would charge to get to recover monies. Sometimes these boxes were brutal (we used to see those box breaks on here all the time) and sometimes the seller "let one get away" but the case hit was already hit so it was a cost recovery exercise. Yes, you could get some good deals but the odds of hitting anything of value was slim.

I purchase certain items at my local card shop but the selection isn't that vast.

I also don't consider an LCS as the lifeblood of the hobby or the place where I interact with other collectors. I feel that was the case 10+ years ago. I just don't have the time to go to an LCS during normal working hours.

I now use online forums, blogs, etc. to interact with other collectors. They're my life blood now. And I can access them 24/7.

This is also a great point - the hobby has evolved into the internet's 24/7 access. You can come on great sites like this and buy/sell/trade and discuss the hobby. It is a great way to share the hobby (although some of us still enjoy the real life interactions as well). And you can buy wax on here as well. This site has Sponsor LCS's which offer you product at very decent pricing. Again, not to self promote (although I am), we sell a good deal of wax on here and through our web-site (as do the other shops). I can't speak for the other sites but we have even created a buying club for the frequent buyers to offer increased savings...

The LCS should also give you something else - the knowledge that if something is wrong with the product - you have someone to hold accountable or assist in correcting the issue.

Lastly - I get very offended when anyone says LCS's price gouge. That is a BOLD statement suggesting they are intentionally screwing people. You don't know what they paid for the product (reorders are often more money to buy) or, in the case of seeing product on sale at a show - if they are dumping product because they have another big order coming in. I challenge anyone one of you to start up a business and see exactly what it takes to run it before making comments about the business practises of others.

This hobby is about FUN - especially for the LCS owners.

Not to sound like a hypocrite but if it was not about the fun, we would open clothing stores... LOL
 
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I understand the arguments in favour of buying from your LCS. And over the years I enjoyed buying from LCS as well. But the bottom line is money. I will always buy where I can get the best deal and save the most money. Sure the comradery and personal service is nice, but I would still continue to buy 99% of my cards from ebay and some other online websites. Like most people, I have bills to pay, a family and other expenses, so I can't afford to do the LCS a favour and help him stay in business if his prices are too high. It's simple economics - the best or cheapest prices gets the sale, and most often this is from ebay.


couldnt agree more not my job to keep the LCS in business by paying higher costs
 
The unfortunate theme that seems to ring through in all of this is that the hobby has become about money and not a hobby. Personally, I don't mind spending a bit more to have the product right there rather than wait for a week to get it in the mail and support someone I know and consider a friend.
 
Pricing at LCS usually depends on how good of a client you are. Have you bought from him many times before? Maybe if you start pre-ordering all your wax from him, you'll get a better deal. My LCS owner (who has also become a very good friend of mine), gives me a great deal on wax. I buy everything from him and pay well under regular retail because he knows I spend all of my hobby $$$ at his shop including supplies. I will also help him sell singles online and often sell him many of the cards from my breaks (at a discounted price) when he has clients for them. It's a win-win for us both.

The shop you frequent paid approximately $1200 for the 10-box case. At $1450, he's making just over 20% profit which is pretty close to full retail. I'd have a talk with the owner. Tell him you plan on becoming a regular case breaker and see what kind of deal he's willing to cut you. Doesn't hurt to ask
 
If i have a urge to open a single box ill go to my LCS, usually 10$ higher per box then i would pay at Queencan or at a show in Montreal.Its not worth the hassle to drive in Montreal.

For a case tho its another story, why would i pay 960$ for a case of series 1 when i can get it for 800$ delivered.
 
Maybe if you start pre-ordering all your wax from him, you'll get a better deal.


Inquired a few times about this, WON'T do it, price is what the price is


I'd have a talk with the owner. Tell him you plan on becoming a regular case breaker and see what kind of deal he's willing to cut you. Doesn't hurt to ask


Done that to, hasn't gotten me any where.

And also for everyone, do not PM to inquire names of places from me, i am not mentioning anyone name/place etc.

This is probably a thread that i just started out of frustration, i know 2 places about 2 hrs from me that i like, i think its time to support them a little more
 
If i have a urge to open a single box ill go to my LCS, usually 10$ higher per box then i would pay at Queencan or at a show in Montreal.Its not worth the hassle to drive in Montreal.

For a case tho its another story, why would i pay 960$ for a case of series 1 when i can get it for 800$ delivered.

I think this is the best post in this thread. For collectors, trading, opening the occasional pack, supplies - absolutely support your LCS or go to local shows. This is and always will be the core of the hobby.

But for the hard-core rippers who open by the case(s) and sell at shows and/or on eBay (the hobby needs those people, right??) then cost becomes a factor. Not only are they well within their rights to shop elsewhere to get the best price, but they are bad business people if they do not.
 
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The shop you frequent paid approximately $1200 for the 10-box case. At $1450, he's making just over 20% profit which is pretty close to full retail. I'd have a talk with the owner. Tell him you plan on becoming a regular case breaker and see what kind of deal he's willing to cut you. Doesn't hurt to ask

Couple of questions/points, Frank:

1) When you say the shop paid $1,200 for a case of ITGU, are you including the taxes in that?
2) If 20% profit is really full retail, I don't know how any store would stay in business. How could anyone run a business (with an actual retail space and employees) successfully on that margin?
 
Then I've seen guys who have been incredibly generous and fair to collectors. I have to give a shout out to Derek at OT Sports cards. He always lets my son pick out some base cards to take him home, and it makes him so happy. If my son is happy, then so am I.

This reminds me of my daughter when she was 4 to 10 years old, and a generous B&M/show dealer. Every couple of shows, my daughter would come with me, and make trips to the store.

Ferris (Ryan) would have a nice little stack of Selanne and Kariya cards for her most times. Nothing super special, but a nice little stash. She'd give him 5 bucks from her allowance, and he'd give her the cards. She was happier than the proverbial pig.

She still collects them (though not to the degree she did) and still has her binders full of stuff from Ryan on display.

As for the topic at hand... it sounds like the OP's LCS is run by a bit of a weird guy. If I went to an LCS and wanted to give him a healthy chunk of prepay cash up front for a break in price, and he said 'no' I can guarantee you he'd never even get money for a package of toploaders from me.

Doesn't sound a bit like an LCS owner I'd ever want to do business with, and yes, the gas is an expense, but go to Calgary or Edmonton to get your cases. You support some great people (some are members here), and you get your product on the release date.
 
In my opinion this thread should really be titled "and why should I support xxxx?"

Fill in your own answer there but as consumers we should be asking this question about everything. It has been stated time and time again that we all vote with our wallets - at times that is painful for the consumer but if we are really looking to impact any type of change, money is our only vote.

In the end it is the business owners duty to give you a reason to shop there - and that is not limited to a LCS. There are empty shops all over the place that whine and complain that hey make no money and can't compete but all they to is cling to the way business "should be done" and make no effort to change.

Different issues pop up when dealing with the online dealers - loyalty, speed, trust, overall costs, that feeling of community and having a place to bust cards and have a few laughs, etc, etc.

As a consumer - there are times when I take advantage of what the large internet retailers offer me. For my collecting, that generally means older wax that has sat on the shelves that is now being liquidated - I like getting cheap old stuff and don't mind the wait. There are also times when I frequent the local guys - when I want to break the newest products, when I need a small amount of supplies, when I want to browse something that isn't hockey, etc.

To me there is no blankent statement that can be made that LCS is better than the internet retailers - and the inverse isn't true either. Much like (IMO) no one can tell me that one card company is "better" than one of the others - I would prefer to hit them each up at times when they strike my fancy.

But whether you are talking about B&M shops, online retailers, cable providers or internet forums - the question one needs to ask is "Why am I supporting this?" - and if you can't answer it, I have to wonder why you opened your wallet.

Happy collecting all!
 
I guess I'm more fortunate than most in that I have a great LCS.

They have really upped their game since I've been back here in Kelowna as there's monthly trade nights, they're participants in all the major UD/Panini/ITG programs, and they do quite a few giveaways throughout the season. They know that if there's a nice Habs card pulled that it never hurts to give me a shout, and they've picked up a few things for me on Check Out and elsewhere.

I'm not a big dollar spender but whenever I'm in there I try to make a purchase of some kind, whether it's just supplies (can never have enough top loaders these days) or a couple packs of whatever. Least I can do for them after talking their ears off every Saturday, amirite? It's a good relationship and if it weren't for those guys my Gorges PC wouldn't be nearly as awesome as it is because they've had so many of his early cards due to the Rockets connection.

I'll always champion a place like that - and I hope that the rest of you can be as fortunate to find a good LCS near you. You'll be amazed at what you can access with a good shop.
 
I think most responses here have been in terms of case and box breaking. I buy singles so this doesn't apply to me. I don't have a local card store but I'm a frequent traveler and I think this is a market not given enough thought. I spend about %99 of my card budget on the internet buying singles from places like COMC and ebay. Every now and then I'll stumble across a shop that has a great collection of autographs and I'll empty my pockets there. The one thing I wish card shops did more was embrace the online world. I find most are run by the older generation and don't completely understand that if your not online, you don't exist to my generation. I wish shops would put a little more effort into their websites. Many times if I'm in a city and I look up LCS I can't even tell if I'm going to a game card or sports card shop.

Some pictures of inside the store help a lot, this lets me know if they have boxes of singles or stick with unopened wax. If there are boxes of singles, what's in them? I don't want a complete breakdown but 'vintage hockey' or 'new baseball' lets me know what you specialize in. The closest LCS to me buys a good number of personal collections and this makes up a lot of their singles. I wish they had some sort of twitter or facebook page and every time they would by a new collection post perhaps a picture and small description of it. If it looks promising then I'll make the extra trip in to check it out, and likely pick up a few other things while I'm in.
 
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Alright, well some very good points have been raised in this thread, but I will just chuck in my opinions on the issue at hand.

My Dad always told me to not necessarily judge a person/group based on the actions/words of one or more individuals on that group. I'm not trying to bash the OP, as they certainly have a right to be mad, but this "pre-school" type of advice holds some valuable weight in this discussion. It's completely unfair to hold all LCS in the same light of one possibly whacked out owner. It happens everywhere. When you've been around retail enough, and I have worked in a couple of places, you begin to find out that while the products may be fantastic - the person in charge may certainly be rotten. It's life. It's reality. It happens in this hobby.

However, in my case, my LCS was the catalyst that elevated my interest back into the hobby and really got me into hockey collection, to be quite honest. I was always dedicated to football cards in my early collecting days with my old man. That changed with the return of the Jets - just like every kid (young or old) - my interest gravitated to the group of hockey players that would be representing our city in the NHL. After years, I finally went back to some of our LCS in the area, and I became closer and closer to former NHL-er Joe Daley. Joe was amazing from the start. Not only was he willing to chat with me and kind of school me up - he was one of those guys that would be talking about playing against Tretiak in front of about a group of five-six people - with only maybe two or three guys spending money that day at the store. Of course, in a perfect world, you'd like to see everybody drop some money in your store. Nonetheless, as Joe told me one day, "the kid with five dollars scrunched up in his hand is just as important as the guy walking in with thousands of dollars to grab a case or two at any given time." This remark just oozes with truth, and to be quite honest, gets lost in the shuffle and fast pace of this hobby.

I've been fortunate and lucky to develop a connection with the owner of my LCS. I know that. But, I've always believed in supporting honest, hard-working, and dedicated people who believe in their craft or product(s). Sure, that product may be a couple of dollars more at his store, but you have to remember, that guy also has a family to feed, as in most cases it is one's livelihood.

The friendships I have made in this hobby far outweigh any book value, sell value, or any type of value that gets chucked around these days. On top of that, in a world where everything moves at a frenetic pace - it is beyond rewarding to just forget about things, drive to the LCS, and start talking about that hockey game last night. At the end of the day, the fun, the people, and the camaraderie in this hobby is what keeps me coming back for more.
 
I have read most of the replies here and would like to add my two cents. The hobby IS a business and any retail establishment is going to be about making as much money as possible. Any LCS charges as much as they can and such things as location play into their costs.

I would much rather deal with people at my LCS and watch my fellow collectors bust wax with a few of them being friends of mine rather than watching a whole bunch of strangers essentially gamble their money away during group breaks. Group breaks have become dull and boring for me actually sinçe it's the same thing being pulled over and over again and a lot of the breakers have little or no personality and only care about the money they are making.

There are only a couple of live breakers I will be a part of since the atmosphere in the rooms I frequent has a distinct LCS feel and not just some guy sitting in his basement trying to fill a case of whatever it might be. That being said, the LCS despite all these group breaks and raffles going on online will continue to strive and survive and it essentially has to since w/o it where will those without internet access get their dose of cards?

I am also someone that rarely buys or sells cards online and I know I am in the minority and I pretty much only use the internet to view breaks from those places I already mentioned. Don't get me wrong I still get excited about watching online breaks, but it just isn't the same as experiencing the same thing in person.
 
Maybe I missed this being brought up, there are alot of replies, and I've been glossing over them, so forgive me if I reiterate something already said.

It seems so far this has been a discussion about "Online Vs. Brick-N-Mortar", as if to assume that most LCS don't have an online presence. I would say most, if not all of the card stores in my area have a healthy income from EBay and other sites. As has been said, and I'm sure is correct, a store could never prosper with prices in competition to online retailers. That is why they supplement their business with an online presence.

Some even join online communities and advertise events in their store, as well as handle some business that way.

Actually, my experience is that this practice makes some dealers pretty shady. They seem to never have product in their stores, but available online instead. The boxes on the shelves are usually searched or the remains of a case, after they've already pulled the case-hits.

Let me break away to bring up a different point. It's not "Should I patronize my local LCS ?" It's more like "Does my LCS DESERVE my business??".

I have a great advantage. I live within easy driving distance of Dave & Adams warehouse. I also live a 10 min. drive maybe from 2 different of their storefronts, and add to that a good amount of other LCS places where I can shop.
I KNOW I can drive to the warehouse and pick up product for cheaper than any store, but I don't, for the reasons listed above. I want that interaction with my fellow cardboard lunatics. I want to watch them open stuff, and they want to talk about stuff and watch me crack as well. I LIKE picking boxes myself, not some kid in a warehouse.

So, I pay a little more. I know it's to keep the lights on. I understand. But, if that price in store was SO MUCH MORE, then I would have to ask why.

The other point to that is, I go to the warehouse for products that no store will get in for me, even though I'm willing to pay for it up front. I guess those guys don't want my business and money coming into the store. Some people are just afraid of success.


Case in point. I walked into a local store and asked if he had any of product X. He told me no, but he would order it for me from "the warehouse", and quoted me a price about $20/ box more than the store down the street. Also, remember, I can literally walk out the front door and drivde to the D&A warehouse myself in a 1/2 hour. Let me add this bit of information. His "store", is an addition onto his house in a zoned mixed-commercial area. It's like selling cards out of your "man cave", you walk in and his friends are watching TV or playing PS4 while you shop. There isn't a huge overhead to keep the lights and water running.
He wasn't just more expensive, he was unwilling to do anything to earn business.

just my personal thoughts and rant.
 
LCS have over head cost that most online places don't. Back in the early 90's during the boom there was card shops every where. After the boom died obviously so did most of these shops. I miss having all these shops to go to so I support my LCS whenever possible. Yes I buy online and on here but thats mostly stuff I want but isn't available at my shop, that happens esp being a player collector. However I want my LCS to survive as I love going there and the owner is a friend of mine. Since we moved I don't get to visit often but whenever I am in town I do my best to go in there and drop some bucks. I buy all my box from him as well as a lot of single (esp vintage) and often cards from him on ebay as well. We need and should want these shops to remain they are a very important part of the hobby that won't happen if we don't support them.
 

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