Call to Upper Deck - Not a Happy Camper..

That's it, I'm out. Again.

If my Hot Prospects rookie set doesn't have a Phaneuf in it then I don't want to finish it.

EDIT: Just had an interesting thought....I've got a dozen or so redemptions that I don't expect to ever receive and will likely get replacements for. What happens if I go to a show this weekend and buy up a bunch of "worthless" redemptions, any set or player will do, and run my portfolio count? Will this increase my likelihood of getting a more kick-*** card as a replacement??

Hmmmmmm.....

And what about older unopened wax? What happens to redemptions that haven't been redeemed yet?
 
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That didn't work when Fleer was about to go out of business- my buddy had that same thought and bought tons of redempts for next to nothing thinking he would get really nice replacements- he got jack shiitakes man.

what a friggin' nightmare.

Dave
 
DredJAw said:
I will never ever ever buy a single redemption card again. I will wait until they appear LIVE on ebay or something before forking any money over.
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I totally agree, almost all of my redemptions are for Spezza's that I purchased, even if someone gets me an "equivalent" BV card, I never would have paid that much for it. So now I've "bought" something for my tradelist (and likely something that everyone else has, so it's a useless trader). I haven't bought a redemption card in a year, and won't buy another one ever. The "best" redemption process is going to get a lot more unpopular once dealers aren't able to quickly get back their investment in a box, as no one buys a redemption, and they must wait to get the card before they make the sale.

Think about it, how many cases are you going to break to sell singles if you have to wait 6 months (if you're lucky) to actually get the high end - not a very good investment!
 
My Phaneuf from SPA says it's shipped so I pray that is the real thing and not a replacement.

Vegas- Any word on that card with your sources?
 
i bought sundin redemptions(paid huge)
i will more than likely get guerin or weight(worthless)
what a kick in the junk
i think i might start collecting beanie babies
 
mikeysleafs i got some mcd's beanie babies if you want them :D

anyways still waiting on my redemptions but not holding my breath :eek:

topher
 
That really ****. Im pleased that i have only three redemptions in progress (three Filppula Hot Prospect cards). Nothing huge for me but still i dont want any Guerin autos or other sh** for replacement. This is so wrong for those how have some great cards in progress and those who pay good money for Ovechkin BD and which is now UD "great replacement". Im not going to buy any redemption cards ever again..

Mika
 
It's times like these when I appreciate the fact that I am not obsessive enough to collect a player. I would have been happy to pull a redemption so that I could complain loud enough to get a better card in replacement of whatever redemption I had. But player collectors can't do that. That must ****.
 
meatmancgy said:
Hmmmm... a call to my lawyer Wednesday morning methinks.
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Your not alone Bruce.

My question is this (someone hinted towards it already). How about older wax that the big hits were redemption? This brainstorm by idea has rendered that stuff useless. Example, 05/06 Rookie Update was complete garbage to rip, now factor in that the ao rookie and many others were redemption. Folks we now have wax that was $100 a box down to what....$10? $12 per box?
 
Meth68 said:
Your not alone Bruce.

My question is this (someone hinted towards it already). How about older wax that the big hits were redemption? This brainstorm by idea has rendered that stuff useless. Example, 05/06 Rookie Update was complete garbage to rip, now factor in that the ao rookie and many others were redemption. Folks we now have wax that was $100 a box down to what....$10? $12 per box?
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That's a poor example. If I read correctly the higher end stuff and high visibility stuff will still be released. You seem to be implying that every redemption up until yesterday is going to be null and void, which I highly doubt is the case. IMHO, UD is aiming to clean up the millions of Max Afinogenov, Ladislav Nagy, Rick Nash and Daniel Alfredsson SOTT's and other similar cards that are probably still outstanding, not the AO RC's, Gretzky auto's and the like....
 
Actually Rob no, I was told any redemption that has been pending for longer then 6 months will be replaced regardless if its a $8 or $800 card. This even includes The Cup Auto/Patch rookies and SP Authentic rookies. The plan is to wipe the slate clean. I have 15+ redemptions, none of which are from the tough signers like maxim, nagy, nash, kovalchuk or alfredsson. And I was told all of them will have to be replaced, after asking questions he said its not an isolated replacement going on its a clean sweep type of deal.
 
I've also made a few calls to UD. One of the interesting things is that a number of higher-echelon UD flacks are involved in cleaning up this debacle. There remain some problems with outstanding autos - players refusing to sign for one reason or other, and there are a couple notable idiots in that group (Mats Sundin, take a bow).

In the discussion I had with UD, I made three things very clear:
1. There are some cards I have for which replacements are not acceptable. These are cards I redeemed on someone else's behalf. If replacements become necessary, I expect appropriate replacements to suit that party's collecting tastes.
2. For cards that are going to be replaced, I expect cards of comparable value and scarcity in return. I will not accept mittfuls of Ovechkin Black Diamond RCs. If I am being deprived of a $500 card, I expect a single $500 card back.
3. I do not want extras, bonuses, premiums, or any other such horsecrap. All I want are the goods I paid for. No more, no less. That's all I've ever asked of UD, and it's disgusting that they cannot deliver in a reasonable time frame.
 
I am very disturbed by the fact that although they say that the slate will be wiped clean and certain cards won't see the light of day that some will slip out into the collecting world- that Kolzig/AO dual SOTT is a prime example- why have some people gotten replacements and others the card? I have 5 or 6 Zetterberg auto cards on my pending redemption lists at this point and while he is a star player in the league when it comes to being listed in the price guides he isn't always listed. Does that mean that the powers that be will think that he isn't high end enough to produce? And let's say a few of the Flair Showcase inks or the dual SOTT with Franzen do squirt out into the marketplace but officially "don't exist". This crap where we don't know where we stand has got to stop- whether it be UD, Topps, or DLP, redemptions have got to end unless there is a much more exact method of dealing with delays and replacements.

Dave
 
Steve, During your phone call did you mention those 3 points to them? I mentioned those same exact 3 points because I am in the same boat where I have some pending for someone who traded/purchased prior to being redeemed. I also have one where I traded with a member here where he has a pending redemption for me. Do they replace the card with something he collects? Do they even ask him? Will the deal sum up by me giving up $xx for a hot card only to wait 6 months and receive trash?

I also mentioned that there is no such thing as a fair deal to the customer if it involved more then 1 replacement card for 1 redemption. If I have a pending $300 redemption from 2005/06 that was and still is considered a "hot card", i do not want (4) $75 cards, I also do not want a 3 year old card that has a bloated bv that no one wants.

Steve, when you mentioned all of this did you actually hear what I was told? When I mentioned what I said above, they basically stopped me in my tracks about the 1 for 1 deal because their high end replacement supply is depleted. This is why I keep hinting that absolute chaos is about to come about over the next 30 days. If they are already saying their high end replacement supply is depleted prior to even starting this mass replacement mission we are all in for a world of trouble. I have full intentions of sending back any card I did not agree to accept as a replacement.
 
vegaspuck said:
I talked to a few UD guys yesterday. Vinny, not sure who you talked to, but there are a lot of cards they are still going to pursue before giving up. Mostly ones that were part of sets like the Hot Prospect Auto Patches, the Rookie Update Dual Autos, and The Cup Auto Patches. If they aren't made, there may be a contingency plan to keep the integrity of the set intact as well.
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Chris the person i spoke to is fairly reliable. I even heard the plan to keep the integrity of the set and lets just say the last thing it says is integrity. It wont work and it will just make set builders that much more upset. I know there will be some exceptions, it will be a very small % though.
 
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I spoke with Karvin, who is taking on an immense task with this project. I made all three of those points to him. What it amounts to is that all I expect are the cards I redeemed. If that proves not to be the case, we will have a discussion about replacements. I won't paint HIM into a corner, and I expect the same courtesy in return.
 
vegaspuck said:
Well, the guys I talked to were the ones actually doing the replacing/redeeming/decision-making. There is no perfect way to make this work. It's a darned if they do, darned if they don't kind of deal. If a player won't sign for them, what is UD supposed to do? They can't lock him in a basement and force him to sign. After talking with their auto guy in Dallas, there are lots of situations that mess things up that people never hear about. The biggest is when a player agrees to do the autos...then changes his mind. By then it's too late. The cards have been made and redemptions have been made while they thought he was signing them. Or even worse, the player loses the cards so UD has to figure out if they can make more or pray he finds them.

No matter what they do, they're screwed. The only way they can get out of it is to send everyone 10x what their card was worth. That seems to be the only time no one complains.

But if it's remotely close in value, there will still be tons of people upset. Or if it's a player/team collector that gets a better card of guys they don't like, they'll complain as well. I was already told a few replacement horror stories where collectors refused to take cards that seemed more than equivalent in my mind. They were worth way more or featured players that move a lot better than what they redeemed. Or people simply over valued their card and expected a king's ransom for replacement. Sorry, but not every Kiprusoff or Beliveau auto is worth an Orr, Crosby or Grezky.

The only way to fix it is to grab a flux capacitor, a DeLorean, 1.21 gigawatts and travel back in time to remove the card from production. It's all FUBAR'd from here on out. If they lose a customer, it'll probably sting a little, but being the only NHL card producer, I'm sure they know someone will take that guy's place like people did last year with Sid-mania. Gotta love that monopoly...
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Chris, Sorry to break it to you but your "source" is the same source everyone else is talking about here. I am sure by now you know we all spoke to the same people. See I think if you look at it with a point of view where your already saying "UD is ****ed if they do ****ed it they dont" well your mindset is already on their side of the fence and here is why. Your wrong, the customer is the one thats "****ed" here. The customer was the person who purchased some plain white card for a good amount of money, being a redemption doesnt mean I underpaid for the card by any means. Now we pay a lot for a redemption because we were tricked in believing well this white card is going to be redeemed for this card. Well look where we are now. All we want is the card UD promised us, their little plain card is a note stating its good for xxxx card within 12-16 weeks.

Now the customer pays for a redemption card, they redeem it, they are the ones who have to wait 3-6-9-12-18+ months, the customer is now being penalized for upper decks mistake. Yes its upper decks mistake they promised something they didn't 100% secure, sure its probably the players fault why the card wasn't signed or returned but they never promised us anything, upper deck who has our money did.

So how is the customer rewarded after all of this? Well after 70+ weeks your redemption is replaced what "They" see is a good replacement. You don't think these decisions don't come down well what do we have laying around type of deal because it does. UD is screwing up here they are the ones who should be ****ed not the customer. All we are asking for is the card we were promised, if you cant provide that you should at the very least provide 1 equal value card, equal print run of a player you agree with. This is not the case, instead they will attempt to force replacements down the customers throat and release statements about how well its working out especially since they were in a "****ed if we do, ****ed if we don't" situation.

I will always remember that the customer was wronged here not upper deck, so it's pointless to allow them to just throw random "crap" at us hoping 99% don't complain about it and pushing the other 1% aside. I am just happy that atleast 1 person over at upper deck realizes this is going to be a huge issue and is attempting to put out fires prior to the forest burning to the grown. Karvin is a good guy in my book but he also understands its a business and we are customers. I think he is the only person over there that actually cares if upper deck's customers are happy, which I find funny because their customer service manager could care less.
 
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Hear hear. That's being hugely overlooked here. Although collectors are decrying the disservice done them by the sloppy redemption process, UD is essentially accepting a huge whack on the *** right now. For them to address the problem in an appropriate manner to clear the current logjam is going to cost them an immense amount of time and money.

No, I'm not suggesting we feel sorry for them. I'm simply saying acknowledge what they ARE doing - finally manning up to the problem they created.
 

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