Ebay, ect.. WTF is going on ? !

Drewphoria said:
Phoenix1588 may ask for more than other sellers but, in my experience, he pays more as well. I've had good dealings... I've spent more but in return, he offers more than most collectors would on cards that I have.

And maybe the increase in BINs is that the sellers are trying something new to change the market. Many sellers are getting tired of pulling 'the hits' and getting little in return thru auctions. Having some control is never a bad thing.
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If he a collector, then fine. I have had the same experience with him and unrealistic counter offers. I guess he is a collector that has everything for sale if the price is right. I can except this easier than someone trying to sell at such a high price they never sell it.
 
penfield said:
if you can get the biggest bang for your buck....go for it!!! i am sick of giving away my cards for 99 cents! people complain about the low value on cards...and it is because everyone rips and dumps...kudos to people using BIN OBO more often!!!
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I never said I am against BIN's .. I said i'm sick of the crazy one's ! Like cards that avg about $15 but u see BIN with say a price of $49 !! Insane..
 
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Here is a perfect example of being out of touch:

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/300681191468?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I collect Craig Rivet cards. I have nearly everything ever produced of him. I have literally been watching this card for 2 years. There was a time when it was for a BIN/BO. I offered $25. I received a counter of $54(which is now the BIN price). There have been a couple of examples of outrageous prices for his cards, that I have passed on, but this one is still active.
 
From the seller's viewpoint, maybe it's insane that the cards are going consistently for $15... it's all dependent on your viewpoint.
 
Oh, you mean like asking $125 for a Brayden Schenn gold base parallel out of 11-12 Black Diamond?

Yea, I hear you.
 
I have dealt with this seller numerous times. I always get some nice Wendel Clark cards from him at a reasonable price. He isn't a bad guy to deal with in person to be honest.
Just my two cents.

Secondly, I am a seller and I will list all my items with BIN. I can't afford the chance of letting a card sell for less than I paid for it. I bust wax sparing now btw, I mostly buy and sell now. However I will usually take the first decent offer that comes my way. Almost all of my cards are listed at the Beckett Book Value but I use that as a baseline. For stuff that is NPDTS, I will list it a bit higher than most people would in hopes of a half decent offer coming my way. Again just my two cents and how I would much rather protect my investment than to do auction styles.
 
As I see it, another problem is the fact that many sellers refuse to accept the fact that their cards aren't worth what they think they are...

Why else would you see a seller with a $30 BIN on a card that another seller has listed for $175 BIN (and has it listed for the 25th time)...



If you can't afford to take a loss on opening hi-risk product, then stop ripping it. Nobody is holding a gun to your head. You're just feeding the addiction.
 
habscards said:
I have always been under this impression:

Your card...your price.
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I think you can take this one step further:

Your card...your price...your wasted listing fees. :corn:

I'm totally fine with people asking way than the current market's value on cards, but don't expect them to sell and don't get offended when I offer a price that's more than fair.

The way I see it, there are two kinds of people involved in this hobby. There are collectors and there are people who are out to make money. I'll be lucky to get $300 back on the two tins of The Cup I busted this year at just under $1k. Does that mean that I'm going to hold those cards for ransom because I think I have to make all my money back? No, that's an associated risk of the hobby. You win some and you lose some.

List the cards for a fair price and move on.
 
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lecavalier4 said:
If you can't afford to take a loss on opening hi-risk product, then stop ripping it. Nobody is holding a gun to your head. You're just feeding the addiction.
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Ok we'll all stop ripping the high risk product, then no one will have the chance to add those cards to their collection. For those who don't rip product and then complain about the prices of cards...I'm the one taking the risk and would like to recoup some of my money. I don't rip to make a profit (although it is nice when I do). Nobody is holding a gun to your head to buy the singles either.

The way I look at it is, it is my card I can ask what I want for it. If you don't like my price then make me an offer. It is then my choice to accept the offer or not.

I too list my cards at Beckett book price BIN/BO due to the fact that if I list cards at the going rate all I get is low ball offers. If I start high I have a chance of actually getting what they actually have sold for. Sometimes people have paid the original price, or offered more than I was expecting, that is their choice. I never expect to sell it for the higher price.

Auctions have a lot of variables involved and if any of those variables isn't met it can drastically affect the price you get for the card.

Guess I'm just sick of all the people complaining about prices on a regular basis. I admit that I do as well but I also know, that it is ultimately my choice on what I am willing to pay for a card...or how bad I want it for that matter. If I don't want it that bad I will wait and see if I can get it for a price I am willing to pay, If I want it that bad I will pay that price.
 
lecavalier4 said:
If you can't afford to take a loss on opening hi-risk product, then stop ripping it. Nobody is holding a gun to your head. You're just feeding the addiction.
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these sellers are opening butt loads of high end product AND not moving their inventory. they can afford it. while it may be an addiction, it's definitely an addiction they can afford. if anything your statement actually makes more sense from the seller's point of view as if he said, "if you don't like my prices, don't buy it. nobody is holding a gun to your head. you're just feeding the addiction."
 
Your card, your price.... exactly.

Just because some sellers are more motivated and their cards sell for lower amounts does not mean that everyone else wants to do the same thing.

And with all of the 'free listing' days on eBay, there's no harm in listing and re-listing until the seller is happy.
 
I think it's safe to say that we all agree to disagree. There isn't a right answer. However you do have the option of voting with your wallets and that will eventually determine what does or does not happen. Just have fun with whatever it is you are doing and don't sweat the small stuff. Maybe one day those cards will end up in your hands. I can tell you from experience that I have had 4 cards land in my pc that were once previously priced very high. Patience pays off :)
 
So here is a question:

When does "holding a card for a price the seller is happy with" cross the line between supply and demand and just outright extortion/holding for ransom?
 
capsfan30 said:
So here is a question:

When does "holding a card for a price the seller is happy with" cross the line between supply and demand and just outright extortion/holding for ransom?
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When its listed like 10 times at insane prices say $89 & u are getting offers of $29 or so i'd say thats a good indicator !
 
Bottom line, eBay made their site about auctions so that sellers with tough to find stuff will list their items because they know bidders may have a bid war and may post large proxy bids if they can't be there at the end of the auction. More stuff offered, more selection for the buyer. Win-win.

Then the buyers broke that logic with auction bot programs that snipe at the last moment. as more people got the programs, fewer people started bid wars, choosing to snipe at the end...and snipe on items they barely had interest in. If the seller had a low starting bid, it's a very high chance that if at least two collectors that week weren't on to bid up, the card could go for a dollar.

So eBay has given the sellers a new tool. And now cards are being offered again.
 
As long as there are some sellers who are willing to take what the market is willing to pay at any given time, then for most products all I need to do as a buyer is wait for the right one to come along. This breaks down a little when we deal with super-limited quantities, but I've come to accept the fact that I just may never get that xx/10 card I'm looking for.

Sellers who hold these cards out of the market are simply exercising a form of monopoly power - and this is one of the few areas where they can legally do so. However, that doesn't mean it's a smart business practice - we generally have enough substitutes in our collecting preferences that we can avoid those sellers.

I'm mostly a buyer, but when I do sell, it's to actually move the product - not to have it sit there month after month. I set a minimum price that I think might actually get at least one bid and am perfectly happy to get that price. Everything above that is gravy. This keeps everything nice and simple.

Citing a truism like "My card, my price" is ultimately self-defeating if your intent is to convert your cards into cash. If you insist on getting a price that is consistently above the price most people are willing to pay, you are cutting yourself off from your market and are relying on outliers (e.g., desperate collectors who feel compelled to temporarily exceed their normal price constraints in order to get the card). This is grossly inefficient not only for you but for the market as a whole. I don't know why this isn't apparent to those who engage in the practice, but maybe that's why the hobby industry isn't exactly known for its resilient business models. ;-)

Finally: As a buyer, I don't even bother to read further when I see the seller is phoenix1588 or iceinvestor or any of the other highballers out there. I'll try once or twice to get a seller to accept an established market value, but if they refuse then I don't even bother to try *ever* again. This has grown into also not bothering to make an offer even if I don't know if the seller is reasonable or not. This is the hidden cost of starting out with high prices; you may be willing to take a reasonable offer, but those offers might never even come in.

Sorry for the rambling post, but I too am tired of seeing the stupidly high pricing on items month after month - it dampens my enthusiasm for the hobby in general.
 
I am for the your card - your price mentality. Even if there is only 5 of a card out there I am happy just to see it exists and will find another copy. Everything pops up eventually if you wait long enough and look hard enough.

high priced sellers obviously don't need to sell their cards or they would accept offers. I don't understand why people think they have to.

I haven't tried it with Phoenix but I have contacted other sellers with high prices and asked what they collect and worked out a trade that cost me far less than buying the card from t hem. Has anyone tried that route with Phoenix?
 
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