2fnlo
Verified Trader
Phaneuf is already been in Norris talk
Its ok I know its hard for a Canucks fan to admit.
Erik Johnson vs. Dion Phaneuf
- Thread starter hockeykid87
- Start date
Phaneuf is already been in Norris talk
Its ok I know its hard for a Canucks fan to admit.
timber09
www.lumberjackcards.com,
Phaneuf is already been in Norris talk
So have a lot of people (Gonchar to name one that has no business in the conversation) - that hardly means that they are ready to step up and take the baton. You can't honestly think that he is in the same class as Lidstrom or Pronger can you.
I like Phaneuf - for what he is - he's fun to watch and overall he is really good for hockey and we need more players like him - but that doesn't make him the top defenseman in the league.
2fnlo
Verified Trader
No your right, he can't touch either of those two, his only chance last year was because of their injuries. But really if he continues to improve, as Lidstrom continues to age who else is going to step up?
dburzyn
Verified Trader,
This has nothing to do with anything, other than the fact i dont like phaneuf... check out him being stood up by OVY 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbya_LL9eBE&feature=related
Dave
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbya_LL9eBE&feature=related
Dave
Chinner
Verified Trader
Pfft how can we forget the "Next" Lidstrom? ALEXANDER EDLER, the guy is a stud offensive d-man. Give him the proper time to mature, he'll live up to expectations and take home the Norris like Lidstrom does.
stab107
New member
You obviously haven't watched many games, then. Phaneuf makes great outlet passes. I think someone is jealous
.Another Red Wing would be one of the first answers to your question!!!
Niklas Kronwall will be a Norris candidate as soon as his Captain retires.
He has decent offensive skills - and will get even more when he mas the 1st PP unit instaed of the 2nd with Lidstrom gone. He can hit - but NEVER gives up the play to make the hit. He sees the ice better than Phaneuf or either Johnson. He simply does not take foolish penalties (44 PIM last year) - and he was +25 while on the ice when Lidstrom was not (so the numbers are not uplifted by playing with Lidstrom - like Ralfalski's are). Injuries will be the only factor - can he stay healthy???
How can no one mention Jay Bouwmeester ??/
Plays on an awful team - and yet he puts up decent numbers, plays about the most per game of anyone and has no help frm his O-men at all??? Put him on another team - and a little more coaching and he will be a top 3 candidate every year.
bruce
Umm - I think you may want to double check those stats??????
Last year Phaneuf had 17 goals.
Mike Green (Caps) 18 Goals
Z Chara (Bruins) 17 Goals
A Markov Habs) 16 Goals
B Burns (Wild) 15 Goals
J Bouwmeester15 Goals
You could go to 06/07 where Phaneuf was 5th in Goals scored :
S Souray (Habs) 26 Goals
D Boyle (T Bay) 20 Goals
P Boucher (Stars) 19 Goals
L Visnovsky (Kings) 18 Goals
D Phaneuf (Flames) 17 Goals
S Weber (Preds) 17 Goals
I would list the 05/06 stats but it is more of the same - Phaneuf had 20 Goals for 2nd place - but there were 8 other within 5 goals of him.
I am not a Phaneuf hater - although I personally think he is over-rated with this Norris talk. But - stats are so easy to look up by year on NHL.com - I just read your claim and knew it was not in the realm of reality. maybe you meant young defenseman........ but J Bo and M Green and S Weber and B Burns are all the same age as Phaneuf.
bruce
2fnlo
Verified Trader
Really this is starting to sound like a thread for
DUH DAH DAH DAH!!!!!!!
Canucks Homer!
All joking aside. If you had to pick:
Phaneuf of Johnson, everyone takes Phaneuf. So far he is the only proven commodity. No one can say what tomorrow will hold, but right now Phaneuf is better.
Really in the end its all a matter of opinion. So you can all tell me how awesome Edler is, Johnson is, J-Bo is, and how much Phaneuf sucks, is defensively irresponsible, and overrated. I will just sit back and be glad Phaneuf is the one in the Flaming C and not any of those other guys. You can say your happy, and maybe you are, I know I am.
DUH DAH DAH DAH!!!!!!!
Canucks Homer!
All joking aside. If you had to pick:
Phaneuf of Johnson, everyone takes Phaneuf. So far he is the only proven commodity. No one can say what tomorrow will hold, but right now Phaneuf is better.
Really in the end its all a matter of opinion. So you can all tell me how awesome Edler is, Johnson is, J-Bo is, and how much Phaneuf sucks, is defensively irresponsible, and overrated. I will just sit back and be glad Phaneuf is the one in the Flaming C and not any of those other guys. You can say your happy, and maybe you are, I know I am.
2fnlo
Verified Trader
Add up his 3 year goal total and compare it to any other d mans three year goal total of the three years. Phaneuf has more goals in the last 3 years combined than any other defenseman has in the last three combined. I don't know if it is true or not but I think thats what suitman19;904545 meant.
Last edited:
timber09
www.lumberjackcards.com,
I realize that I am probably pegged as a Canuck Homer here, however, Edler is solid but he has a LONG way to go before we start talking Norris - he's not even one of the top two or three defensemen on his own team yet.
And if I am picking a Flame to win the Norris, I'm giving it to Regehr - that guy is a monster and one of the most underrated defensemen in the league. There are a lot of guys in that same vein (stud stay at home guys) that don't get enough talk because they don't have the goddy stats but that is where the real men are...in my opinion.
And if I am picking a Flame to win the Norris, I'm giving it to Regehr - that guy is a monster and one of the most underrated defensemen in the league. There are a lot of guys in that same vein (stud stay at home guys) that don't get enough talk because they don't have the goddy stats but that is where the real men are...in my opinion.
gratzi
Resident Iginla Stalker , Verified Trader,
Like other Flames fans have said, Phaneuf has been getting better on the defensive side and isn't always going for the big hit, which would lead to a lot of misses and opposing 2 on 1's. I do think in 5 years time he will be THE defenseman in the NHL that everyone is talking about if he keep working on his D, cause then he will be able to do it all.
stab107
New member
this is why the league should create the bobby orr award for the best offensive d-man and make the norris for the best defensive d-man. iirc, orr lead the league in points one year and for a d-man (especially today) that is unthinkable. it's a simple solution, i mean they do have the selke for forwards...
edit: lol, i just looked up some stats and orr was +124 in 70-71 and is +597 overall. he is also the only d-man to win the art ross
Last edited:
pathshot
Verified Trader,
This sounds about right. Dion Phaneuf has a good 54 goals in his first three seasons. I did some quick math, Schneider and Chara rank 2nd at 44, with Visnovsky at 43, Souray at 41 - mostly due to last year's injury. Bryan McCabe, Dan Boyle and Nicklas Lidstrom were close as well, with 39.
A total of 7 defensemen have made the league's top 30 each of the last 3 years - Phaneuf, Schneider, Chara, Lidstrom, Pronger, Blake and Gonchar.
Staying healthy has been paramount to Phaneuf's total; he's missed 3 games in three seasons.
-m.
A total of 7 defensemen have made the league's top 30 each of the last 3 years - Phaneuf, Schneider, Chara, Lidstrom, Pronger, Blake and Gonchar.
Staying healthy has been paramount to Phaneuf's total; he's missed 3 games in three seasons.
-m.
Boom Boom
Verified Trader,
Dion has been on a tear since his rookie year. If he can avoid injury, and keep up these consistent numbers.....he will be up for the Norris for many years to come.
Orca Pod
Bitter, Jaded & Disillusioned!,
I've said it before, and will most likely say it again. Dion will have his name on the Norris a lot in the future. Once he actually learns how to switch from backwards to forwards to the left side, a lot of his defensive burns will be gone. There's something about that skating switch he just can't master.
His defensive game definitely needs some improving, as he is currently nowhere near some of the other Dmen his age when it comes to defense. He has improved every year in this department, and in another couple of years, will easily be one of the top 3 Dmen in the league.
The kid will dominate like Lidstrom and Pronger and will be a mainstay on Team Canada for years to come. Anyone who says they would not want him on their team is full of it.
Johnston? - Potential is there to be an absolute stud. But no one will see because he is in St. Louis, unfortunately. No one notices him there, just like no one appreciates Edler as much as they should - most people rarely see those two play, so they can't really judge what Blues and Canucks fans are saying. Same with Shae Weber. These guys are all better than Dion defensively right now. Will they stay that way? Probably not. Do they get enough credit for what they do when compared to Dion? Definitely not.
His defensive game definitely needs some improving, as he is currently nowhere near some of the other Dmen his age when it comes to defense. He has improved every year in this department, and in another couple of years, will easily be one of the top 3 Dmen in the league.
The kid will dominate like Lidstrom and Pronger and will be a mainstay on Team Canada for years to come. Anyone who says they would not want him on their team is full of it.
Johnston? - Potential is there to be an absolute stud. But no one will see because he is in St. Louis, unfortunately. No one notices him there, just like no one appreciates Edler as much as they should - most people rarely see those two play, so they can't really judge what Blues and Canucks fans are saying. Same with Shae Weber. These guys are all better than Dion defensively right now. Will they stay that way? Probably not. Do they get enough credit for what they do when compared to Dion? Definitely not.
dburzyn
Verified Trader,
No one mentioned either of those two because the thread is "Johnson VS Phaneuf" not "Whos going to be the next great defenceman?"
ryancalgary
Verified Trader
Bruce
Stats are fine - in his three years in the league Phaneuf has scored 54 Goals, second is 44. It's not even close, you can check it out. Look at those lists of Top 5 - Phaneuf is the only one in the top in all three seasons (05-06 he was #2 to Schneider). His total for the three seasons blows everyone away.
EDIT - 2fnlo and pathshot beat me to it.
Last edited:
marvelman55
Banned User
I haven't seen enough of Johnson to say who is better, all I can say is that Phaneuf is a once in a generation talent. He has a booming shot similar to Al MacInnis, hits very similar to Scott Stevens, and can pass and carry the puck pretty well too. As has been mentioned, before the beginning of last season, I called Phaneuf overrated, as his defensive game made me laugh. He tightened up a lot over the course of last year, and is now fairly steady in his own zone, and he has even passed up a few monster hits so he wouldn't take himself out of the play. If he keeps improving like he did last year, nobody will compare with Phaneuf.
JohnnyDrama
Verified Trader,
I didn't get to see alot of JMFJ last season, but his skills are off the charts. He, to me at least, has the greatest upside of the three. But upside is a tricky thing.
