ITG UM 11 Preview...WOW...

I'm of the belief that the Ultimate Emblem/Number/Etc sets should take a year off and then be used every other year. This allows more time for ITG to acquire quality jerseys and come at us with a bang like they did with UM9. With UM10 we saw more junior team jerseys used and many of the emblem cards had smaller swatch windows (where UM9 all were cut to fit the full size of the card) which indicated to me that the concept was being stretched too thin. We are now seeing these jumbo patches in Superlative and Enshrined as well, how much longer can the ITG inventory hold up to this and still deliver a diverse checklist of players and unique swatches?

On the other hand ITG set a pretty high standard for high-end releases when UM9 came out so maybe they have no choice but to keep doing it. Just hope the checklists can stay strong.
 
By the way - I love that the cards are slabbed...... but I have to store them in the Graded size team bags so that they do not scratch the case. Wish there was a way around that???
 
I'll add a few more points in response to what others are saying.

Ultimate has been slabbed from day one so I don't ever expect that to change. I'm the type of sentimental collector that likes to have access to the memorabilia so I can actually touch something that the player touched, that being said it is part of the character of Ultimate and ITG offers plenty of other non-slabbed cards that we can grope as much as we like.

On sticker autos, yeah I tend to agree that for the price point hard-signed should be expected. Personally I've never collected Ultimate cards for the autos so it doesn't really effect me all that much but I know the majority are turned off by them.

Lastly, I agree with the majority that designs need a major overhaul. UM6 and UM7 looked awful in my opinion, things started turning around with UM8 and by the time UM9 came out the designs had gotten a whole lot better. It seems as though they peaked at UM9, carried over into UM10, and now seem to be following the same trend going into UM11. Something should be done either with the designers themselves or the tools they are given to work with. Bright colors, detailed textures, and foil trims would be a good start. Not sure if the printing facility has anything to do with this or not but it looks like some of the cards were printed on a home printer. Detail and color are the keys to a good design and even considering limitations when it comes to photography there's no reason the rest of the card can't look so sharp you'd cut yourself on it.

The collectors are speaking Brian, if any card manufacturer can deliver I know it's you!
 
I get the "same as always" viewpoint, but who of us complainers in here can actually come up with ONE "blow us away" card design, let along hundreds over the years?? Sure, there might be one or two great designers on this site, but even they would likely agree that they have maybe one or two designs they love and the rest are "meh". To consistently come up with designs, year after year, must be quite the challenge on a limited budget, especially in the no-license realm.
 
meatmancgy said:
I get the "same as always" viewpoint, but who of us complainers in here can actually come up with ONE "blow us away" card design, let along hundreds over the years?? Sure, there might be one or two great designers on this site, but even they would likely agree that they have maybe one or two designs they love and the rest are "meh". To consistently come up with designs, year after year, must be quite the challenge on a limited budget, especially in the no-license realm.
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Besides budget and license limitations I think part of it might be Brian's loyalty to his staff. The ITG team is small and I figure very tight-knit, I think Brian is the type of person who is just as proud of his staff as he is of his products. He has faith in his designers and they do as much as I can despite the limitations. I can't speak for Brian by any means but that is the feeling I get from him.

If I'm right that's respectable, however sometimes change can be beneficial.
 
meatmancgy said:
I get the "same as always" viewpoint, but who of us complainers in here can actually come up with ONE "blow us away" card design, let along hundreds over the years?? Sure, there might be one or two great designers on this site, but even they would likely agree that they have maybe one or two designs they love and the rest are "meh". To consistently come up with designs, year after year, must be quite the challenge on a limited budget, especially in the no-license realm.
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Bruce, sorry, I don't really understand your argument. If I was a graphic designer, then I would be expected to come up with new ideas and not recycle old ones and pretend they are new ones. I'm not even talking about being 'blown away', I'm just talking about some "different" designs... that would be a start.

Thanks!
LU
 
meatmancgy said:
I get the "same as always" viewpoint, but who of us complainers in here can actually come up with ONE "blow us away" card design, let along hundreds over the years?? Sure, there might be one or two great designers on this site, but even they would likely agree that they have maybe one or two designs they love and the rest are "meh". To consistently come up with designs, year after year, must be quite the challenge on a limited budget, especially in the no-license realm.
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T'is the cross they bear, Bruce.

I think it is more of a riding what's working kind of issue. As many have said, they seem to peak at UM9, and carried that into UM10. Now that they see that fans of the product are getting restless, they'll kick it up a notch again...

Almost time for some double-sided slab-action, I'd say. Wow us with a couple cards we can flip over. Here is my cheesy offerings BACK TO BACKS: teams, players, etc. who have won back to back somethings........ Piece of GU on each side of the card. Yeah, baby......
 
spooner9ball said:
Almost time for some double-sided slab-action, I'd say. Wow us with a couple cards we can flip over. Here is my cheesy offerings BACK TO BACKS: teams, players, etc. who have won back to back somethings........ Piece of GU on each side of the card. Yeah, baby......
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Thats gold Jerry :beer:
 
Best product to rip, 15 cards per box, everyone is a seller.

Small listing time, little to none garbage when you finished your break.:giggity:

Never made a killean breakin it but never lost 50% of my box price either so cant really complain.I put the slabs in graded card holders and they stay as new.I aint a memorabillia `toutcher`, and find kinda creepy those who are...

To bad it dosent have more following, when i saw the sick Mario Emblem last year that didnt cover the box price...kinda made me fed up with the hobby, atleast the breakin part.

Didnt open a box since decades but ill do my best to get the bossman some $$$ to open a box for me at the expo to take advantage of the redemption program and a shot at some nasty cards.
 
drkicker said:
I aint a memorabilia `toucher`, and find kinda creepy those who are...
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Im with you on this one. Fondling a card is kinda strange....

ITG Ultimate is one of the best releases every year. I'll take genuine game used memorabilia, that is slabbed and thus protected from tampering, over fancy "photo shoot" and "event worn" garbage any day. If I wanted to touch non game used or photo shoot quality memorabilia Id go down to the local Sport Chek.
 
most products across the board have been regurgitating themselves for the past 5-6 years.i cant tell the difference between Artifacts,Ultimate or Victory for that matter without a magnifying glass to see the copyright date on the back of the card.ITG Ultimate is a staple,you know what you are going to get.been that way since it's inception.vintage game used,choice swatches & sticker auto's.all slabbed to the dismay of the more "tactile" collectors such as myself.(yes,i'm a "touchy feely" kind of guy).the issue of the stale design is a valid point,while we know the limitations of being unliscenced i think the solution is easily rectified by looking back instead of forward.the first year of Ultimate had die cut auto's(they were hard signed back then)on foil board.many of the game used featured die cut windows for the memorabilia shaped like the Stanley Cup etc.simple things like that could be the shot in the arm this product needs to maintain it's loyal following.check out this years Masks game used redemption program with the emerald foil board,simply stunning cards for a standard game jersey.Dr.Price and company have the ability and i know they will be on top of it to jazz it up in the future.
 
meatmancgy said:
I get the "same as always" viewpoint, but who of us complainers in here can actually come up with ONE "blow us away" card design, let along hundreds over the years?? Sure, there might be one or two great designers on this site, but even they would likely agree that they have maybe one or two designs they love and the rest are "meh". To consistently come up with designs, year after year, must be quite the challenge on a limited budget, especially in the no-license realm.
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Haven't we, though?

I can't seem to find it, but I do recall a lengthy thread last year where HI members shared their ideas for new sets and checklists, at the request of ITG.

A limited budget and lack of license are factors for sure, but some of the designs I have seen produced by HI members involve "thinking outside the box" that collectors seem to be looking for.

I am of the opinion that producing only 7-8 products in one sport (one of which is aided by full licensing) should allow for lots of time to reinvent, refresh and reinvigorate, but I guess as long as people are still buying doubles, no need to go out of your comfort zone.
 
NJDEVILS30 said:
Haven't we, though?

I can't seem to find it, but I do recall a lengthy thread last year where HI members shared their ideas for new sets and checklists, at the request of ITG.

A limited budget and lack of license are factors for sure, but some of the designs I have seen produced by HI members involve "thinking outside the box" that collectors seem to be looking for.

I am of the opinion that producing only 7-8 products in one sport (one of which is aided by full licensing) should allow for lots of time to reinvent, refresh and reinvigorate, but I guess as long as people are still buying doubles, no need to go out of your comfort zone.
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Yes, some HI members have produced SOME cards... my point is, 7-8 products each year with 6, 8, 10, 12 or more subsets in each. Every year. On a limited budget, thus with one or two designers. Without a license. 99% of the cards HI members have made on their own have been images with logos or images that ITG is not permitted to use. I would challenge those HI designers to come up 6 designs each without the ability to use full body shots or images with logos. Let's see how well we do. Who's up for the challenge?!?

It's easy for us to sit back and say "oh, just replace the designers or get more" without understanding the logistics or costs involved in such a change. While Doc Price has listened to members suggestions MANY times, especially here on HI, he can't make everything we want.

By the way, I LOVE Shaun's suggestion and in fact have made that suggestion before. Can you image a 6-patch of classic Habs on one side of a dual and a 6-patch of a classic Leafs or Wings or Rangers or Hawks or Bruins rival on the other? A damn thick card, likely, but DAMN...
 
meatmancgy said:
By the way, I LOVE Shaun's suggestion and in fact have made that suggestion before. Can you image a 6-patch of classic Habs on one side of a dual and a 6-patch of a classic Leafs or Wings or Rangers or Hawks or Bruins rival on the other? A damn thick card, likely, but DAMN...
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Nothing wrong with thick cards. Just something about a thick 120-180pt card stock that gives it a premium, high-end feel. I'd like to see thicker stock for high-end ITG regardless of whether or not it's double sided.
 
ITG Ultimate? Real game used pieces you say? No phony 'made up game' used? Wow, that gets me all warm and tingly like.....

mmmmmmmmmmmm...Ul..ti..mate......mmmmmmmmm

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I am very excited for this year's offering now that Lindros has re-signed so I hope he gets included in some of the patch sets. UM has long been one of my favorite products. I wish there was a little more foil and a lot less black/silver/gold but I buy it for the quality memorabilia pieces. No other company does it like ITG.
 
meatmancgy said:
Yes, some HI members have produced SOME cards... my point is, 7-8 products each year with 6, 8, 10, 12 or more subsets in each. Every year. On a limited budget, thus with one or two designers. Without a license. 99% of the cards HI members have made on their own have been images with logos or images that ITG is not permitted to use. I would challenge those HI designers to come up 6 designs each without the ability to use full body shots or images with logos. Let's see how well we do. Who's up for the challenge?!?

It's easy for us to sit back and say "oh, just replace the designers or get more" without understanding the logistics or costs involved in such a change. While Doc Price has listened to members suggestions MANY times, especially here on HI, he can't make everything we want.
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I'm a designer by profession. I can definitely understand why, if ITG does indeed only have one or two designers, that it would be hard to constantly make things look fresh and new when you're cranking out over 100 designs a year (not to mention all the tedious production work that goes into it; knocking out photos of players, plugging player photos/names/info onto each card, etc.).

As such, I can level with their lower-end products recycling the looks of past years' products. But when you're dropping a product with a $100+/pack price tag, I don't think it's unreasonable for consumers to expect a visual refresh for it every year. I would think that it would be worth a slight uptick in price/pack to hire a freelance designer for a few weeks a year to come in and help out with the design process for Ultimate, as long as it meant card designs that people were actively excited for rather that a chorus of "same old, same old." I admire Dr. Price's passion for the hobby and his willingness to listen to his consumer base. I'm sure he's heard the cries for new designs before, and presumably has his reasons for keeping things the way the are. I hope though, that he continues to evaluate how ITG's designs are being received and does something about it if there's a way to make the economics and logistics work.
 
I can take the (relatively) same designs year in, year out.
I can take the sticker autos at the $100 price point to eliminate redemptions.
At the end of the day, ITG Ultimate is a better buy than other products at the same price point.

What I can't stand is the slab. They're clunky, they take up space (a big issue for dealers where showcase room is key), and they scuff easily.
I'm a tactile person who likes to be able to touch an awesome patch or emblem, as strange as that is...
 

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