Looking for an opinion

winniescards

winniescards

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I recently bought a Bobby Orr rookie off eBay. The person that was selling said in their description that they would not guarantee its authenticity. They also advertised no refunds. So my question is do you think I have a leg to stand on now that I know it was in fact a counterfeit. Or do I just put it behind me as, willing to take a chance and it did not work out. What do you think? Thanks, Winston.:)
 
I think this is going to be a difficult one. The seller clearly stated that it may not be authentic in the description. I say clearly because you indicate that you saw it. I feel like at that point the seller was being honest, and you took the risk. I would feel different if this disclaimer was somehow hidden, or the title and everything else in the auction lead you to believe it was in fact authentic. Perhaps a link to the auction or some more information would help.
 
Sorry Winston, I don't think this one is in your favour. I don't think it matters whether or not the seller knew for sure it was authentic (since he put fair warning on the auction).

Good luck either way.

Glenn
 
How do I leave feedback? Do I leave a negative,or do I leave a positive because the card was delivered.But make a note that it was in fact counterfeit.I do think I need to let others know that it was in fact counterfiet in case they try and sell another one.
I really feel bad for the person the card was for.He was at my house and told me to bid.He was willing to take the chance on the card.So now I have to sell him my rookie.
Thanks a lot guys for your opinion,Winston.
 
what did the seller say if you alerted them that it is in fact a counterfeit ?

how they respond could shape your whole decision to fight it or let it pass.. if he somehow leaks it that he knew it was a counterfeit, i think you've got a case, if he's clueless (atleast appears legitimately clueless), then pass..
 
I would try a claim stating item not as described. If you were lead to believe it was real, you may have a chance. I am a firm believer that the seller is responsible for knowing what they are selling and accurately describing the item. This "may or may not be real" crap doesn't fly with me. Everyone who puts this in their auction listing is knowingly selling a fake/reprint. Good luck and let us know how it goes.
 
terry1hockeyfan said:
I would try a claim stating item not as described. If you were lead to believe it was real, you may have a chance. I am a firm believer that the seller is responsible for knowing what they are selling and accurately describing the item. This "may or may not be real" crap doesn't fly with me. Everyone who puts this in their auction listing is knowingly selling a fake/reprint. Good luck and let us know how it goes.
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I agree!!! Swing it by paypal and see what they say.....
It definitely doesn't hurt trying to get your money back.
 
The fact the seller worded that in his auction description would have immediately scared me away from the auction. Like Terry said, it was a pre-planned ploy to boost sales with a "get outta jail free" card with the disclaimer.
 
I think it was advertised for what it was...an uncertainty. Anyone reading the description knew that and knew the chance being taken, winning the card. Such a description would deter many bidders and likely resulted in a lower winning price. So the buyer would benefit from a low sale price, if it turned out to be real. Conversely, the buyer doesn't get the "steal of a deal" hoped for, if it turns out to be counterfeit. Just my 2 cents...
 
lumm0x said:
The fact the seller worded that in his auction description would have immediately scared me away from the auction. Like Terry said, it was a pre-planned ploy to boost sales with a "get outta jail free" card with the disclaimer.
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People taking this position really bother me. This kind of attitude really discourages full disclosure. If you as the seller are not 100% sure of something you are selling then you owe it to the buyer to disclose that. Look at my trade my thread. I have a Modano auto that may or not be a buyback, but I disclosed it. I have a huge problem with those that are not sure and do not say anything. At least with the disclosure it is up to the buyer, or in this case the bidder, to make the decision on whether or not to go forward with the transaction. For what it't worth, I would rather know everything than assume anything.
 
blindros88 said:
People taking this position really bother me. This kind of attitude really discourages full disclosure. If you as the seller are not 100% sure of something you are selling then you owe it to the buyer to disclose that. Look at my trade my thread. I have a Modano auto that may or not be a buyback, but I disclosed it. I have a huge problem with those that are not sure and do not say anything. At least with the disclosure it is up to the buyer, or in this case the bidder, to make the decision on whether or not to go forward with the transaction. For what it't worth, I would rather know everything than assume anything.
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My thought is that if you are not 100% sure of what you are selling then you should find out before you sell. Or at least give a guarantee that if it is not what you say it is then you will give a full refund.
 
Roll the dice with paypal and hope that they are willing to side with you. Is the seller a collector or was it a one off sale of a hockey card?
 
Paypal is your friend. Whether the seller has those terms or not, paypal should be able to help you should the card be a fake.
 
OK, so the guy says he doesn't know if the card is real or fake. Regardless of why, you were made aware before hand, and the person you said wanted it said he was willing to take the risk. It didn't pan out, and now you want to go and get a refund and leave negative feedback??? One question, if you knew that it MIGHT be a fake, why would you bid on it? Because not knowing may cause it to end lower than normal, taking the chance of getting the card for a pretty cheap price? I think you're taking as much advantage of his description as he is Winston. Using some Paypal policy (which so many are rather happy to throw under the bus in a dozen other threads) would be a bit low in my opinion.
 
I would file with PP regardless, offer to return the card. I thought ebay had stopped letting people sell ungraded versions of Orr and Gretzky rookies?
 
nyrtfleury014 said:
My thought is that if you are not 100% sure of what you are selling then you should find out before you sell. Or at least give a guarantee that if it is not what you say it is then you will give a full refund.
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Agreed with the above sentiment. It's my view that as a seller, I would have a responsibility to tell people what I'm offering up for sale. I mean, this may not be an exact parallel, but what if I posted up some old video games that I knew didn't work, and said, they may or may not work - am I then absolved of all responsibility when you take a chance, win them for a low bid, and find out they're useless?

A seller has to take some sort of responsibility to know what they're selling, or at least offer a full refund if it's not the real thing, doesn't work, or whatever.

It's a tough one, since the seller did list a disclaimer of sorts on the description, so while you may want to push for a refund, you also may end up needing to bite the bullet and call it a learning experience.

Although with that kind of wording, I wouldn't have rolled the dice and bid on it.
 
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I kind of look at this like busting wax; you could have a Gretzky (or Upshall) 1/1 card...you could have a handful of base. You made a purchase on a card that clearly has a chance to be a fake. Like I said, go for a refund, and I really hope you get it. But sometimes you lose when you take a chance.
 
Anybody who buys a vintage card that isn't in some way authenticated leaves themselves open to this issue, and quite frankly should accept that fact and move on. Theoretically, with all the patch faking that goes on, I could legitimately put into my next auction that I make no guarantees that the patch is indeed legit, does that make me a dishonest person? The fact remains, that both Winston and his friend knew there was a possibility the Orr RC could be a counterfeit, they were willing to accept that chance by bidding, no way should PayPal be used to resolve what amounts to little more than buyer remorse. Sorry Winston, but I don't think you or the seller should pay restitution to your friend unfortunately. Those are the risks in dealing on eBay, as nasty as that may seem.
 

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