Ok guys, cheap shot or not?

[wingnut888]

I was at this game and didn't see anything wrong with the hit Kronwall makes on Selanne but since Teemu decided to cry about it and ask for a suspension I figured I'd ask the masses about it. Here is the hit in question

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgJyoIH7cGc

Looks clean to me but maybe as usual I'm biased. Franzen got hit with something similar that I didn't think was suspendable a week or so ago and nothing happened.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0X5D86RQ3VU

Fistric clipped him but he made his move while he went for the hit so I thought it was accidental.

 

[marvelman55]

I don't think it was anything out of the ordinary, other than a hard hit that Selanne mustn't have seen coming.

 

[koondog44]

Time to retire Teemu. He skated head on into Kronwall and he wants a suspension...unreal. The league is turning so soft that within 10 years, the entire season will be played on a PS3 so nobody gets hurt

 

[will-411]

Trev - I think there is a big difference - Selanne never touched the puck. You can see it when they show it from behind Selanne as he follows it up the boards. Kronwall shoots it in, then stiffens into Selanne.

Given that Teemu never touched the puck (maybe way back in the corner when it first came around) he wasn't prepared for the hit, which is why Kronwall got him so good.

However, I'm sure that Kronwall was expecting more of an effort from Teemu to meet his shoulder, given it was Kronwall who should have been a recipient of a hit in this instance.

Primary point of contact was also the head, but it's from straight on, so there shouldn't be anything from that.

If I was reffing the game, I would have called two minutes for interference on Kronwall, and that's it, solely because Teemu never touched the puck. And no, it wasn't a cheap shot.

Cory

 

[lovetheHABS]

nothing big or unseen, but as mentioned before possibly everyone is getting soft?

 

[wingnut888]

Cory, I would have been ok with the interference call. You are right he didn't have the puck (though it passed under him so that's why they didn't call anything I'm guessing). No suspension though as far as I could see. no elbows up and Teemu has to wake up out there.

Trev - I think there is a big difference - Selanne never touched the puck. You can see it when they show it from behind Selanne as he follows it up the boards. Kronwall shoots it in, then stiffens into Selanne.

Given that Teemu never touched the puck (maybe way back in the corner when it first came around) he wasn't prepared for the hit, which is why Kronwall got him so good.

However, I'm sure that Kronwall was expecting more of an effort from Teemu to meet his shoulder, given it was Kronwall who should have been a recipient of a hit in this instance.

Primary point of contact was also the head, but it's from straight on, so there shouldn't be anything from that.

If I was reffing the game, I would have called two minutes for interference on Kronwall, and that's it, solely because Teemu never touched the puck. And no, it wasn't a cheap shot.

Cory

 

[es_19]

i don't think that was a cheap shot; i think kronwall was expecting a hit as well and selanne should've had seen the big winged wheel coming at him

 

[plubers]

Cheap shot? I thought that was hockey!

 

[jmatchett]

I had no problem with the hit. If you are expected to be able to make a play on the puck but decide not to at the point of contact, there should be no penalty. On this, it's almost like Kronwall just braced for a hit he thought Selanne might make.

 

[es_19]

from selanne

"That guy is dangerous out there. One of these days somebody's going to get him, for sure,'' Selanne said. "I know that. It's just a matter of time when. For sure his elbow hit in my face. I didn't see the replay, but I know how it felt."

from babcock

“I looked at the replay many times. (Kronwall) stepped up on him and got his shoulder in his chin. It’s a hockey play,'' Babcock said. "I think one of the comments was Kronner’s dangerous. He is. That’s why we like him.

"I don’t think anything was outside the rules or the boundary of the game. Obviously, you don’t want anyone to get hurt. Teemu’s a Hall of Famer, one of my favorites. I don’t like to see him get bumped, but that’s the game.’’

from kronwall

"I thought he was going to follow through on his check. I was just going to take a step and meet the check,'' Kronwall said. "He didn’t check me at all. That’s what caught him off-guard. I felt I got him with a shoulder.’’

 

[habsheaven]

It was clearly a straight-on shoulder to the face. Hopefully that is never a penalty, unless it is a legitimate interference call or a late hit.

 

[torquewrenchcharlie]

Interference call due to no puck play yes....cheap shot warranting a suspension...no whinny crybaby needs a rocking chair......yep...
IMHO
mick

 

[Orca Pod]

I have looked at about 15 stories on this, and can not find a single one where Selanne asks for a suspension. Can someone direct me to one, or is it that the OP is overreacting?

 

[plubers]

I have looked at about 15 stories on this, and can not find a single one where Selanne asks for a suspension. Can someone direct me to one, or is it that the OP is overreacting?

That annoying guy on sportsnet pacific said Selanne was looking for a suspension on the hit.

 

[NNeves]

I believe this falls under the category of "blows to the head" that was introduced late last year. Kronwall's shoulder clearly contacts Selanne's head. I don't think it's dirty per se, but it definitely the type of hit the NHL is trying to reduce or eliminate due to the high number of concussions recently.

 

[will-411]

I believe this falls under the category of "blows to the head" that was introduced late last year. Kronwall's shoulder clearly contacts Selanne's head. I don't think it's dirty per se, but it definitely the type of hit the NHL is trying to reduce or eliminate due to the high number of concussions recently.

The NHL wants to cut down on head shots, true, but from the blindside and unawares. This was head on, and I'm fairly certain Teemu saw him there...

The quote above from Kronwall verified exactly what I thought when I watched it - Kronwall thought Selanne was going to hit him so he braced and followed through - it looked bad because Teemu didn't brace himself.

And Teemu, we watched the replay - his elbow didn't contact you - it flew by your face as you were assuming the horizontal position from the shoulder you just took.

Is this maybe a little Swedish/ Finnish rivalry going on?

Cory

 

[MMarch]

Couple of opinions on this, again, just opinions.

1. Kronwall is a dangerous player who has delivered many borderline hits. He nailed Havlat when Havlat didn't have the puck, and here Selanne didn't have the puck. Clearly interference.

2. Kronwall has a history of aiming for the head. Some (usually Wing fans) will argue he isn't going after the head but contact is made unintentionally. Looks to me like he was targetting the chest but his shoulder hit the face and he also followed through with the elbow.

3. We are back to the "intent" versus "outcome" debate. Just like all the people who were crying for a suspension on Hjalmarsson for hitting a guy who didn't have the puck, why is this any different? Selanne didn't have the puck, and thankfully he wasn't injured. So, is this not a penalty or suspension because Selanne wasn't hurt? What if he had a concussion? Intent may not have been there, but the outcome was a shot to the face/head.

4. Kronwall is just coming up with an excuse to try and defend himself, because if he really believes he was leaning into the hit because he thought Selanne was going to hit him, well, I have some great bridges to sell you in the Sahara desert. That is the lamest excuse I have ever heard.

Suspension? Only if Selanne was injured because as the NHL has shown, it's not the intent it's the outcome right? Interference call could/should have been made but it happens so quick I can see why they didn't see it that way on the ice. I do agree with Selanne though on one point, one of these days someone is going to nail Kronwall and try to hurt him. He is a on that edge of dirty and dangerous player in my opinion and a few teams owe him. Problem is, the way things seem to be going in todays NHL, the opposition will probably take a run at Datsyuk or Zetterberg instead.

 

[jmatchett]

Just like all the people who were crying for a suspension on Hjalmarsson for hitting a guy who didn't have the puck, why is this any different?

Probably has something to do with hitting a guy straight on versus nailing a guy with his back turned into a fixed object. Just a thought.

 

[FASTMAX]

Couple of opinions on this, again, just opinions.

1. Kronwall is a dangerous player who has delivered many borderline hits. He nailed Havlat when Havlat didn't have the puck, and here Selanne didn't have the puck. Clearly interference.

2. Kronwall has a history of aiming for the head. Some (usually Wing fans) will argue he isn't going after the head but contact is made unintentionally. Looks to me like he was targetting the chest but his shoulder hit the face and he also followed through with the elbow.

3. We are back to the "intent" versus "outcome" debate. Just like all the people who were crying for a suspension on Hjalmarsson for hitting a guy who didn't have the puck, why is this any different? Selanne didn't have the puck, and thankfully he wasn't injured. So, is this not a penalty or suspension because Selanne wasn't hurt? What if he had a concussion? Intent may not have been there, but the outcome was a shot to the face/head.

4. Kronwall is just coming up with an excuse to try and defend himself, because if he really believes he was leaning into the hit because he thought Selanne was going to hit him, well, I have some great bridges to sell you in the Sahara desert. That is the lamest excuse I have ever heard.

Suspension? Only if Selanne was injured because as the NHL has shown, it's not the intent it's the outcome right? Interference call could/should have been made but it happens so quick I can see why they didn't see it that way on the ice. I do agree with Selanne though on one point, one of these days someone is going to nail Kronwall and try to hurt him. He is a on that edge of dirty and dangerous player in my opinion and a few teams owe him. Problem is, the way things seem to be going in todays NHL, the opposition will probably take a run at Datsyuk or Zetterberg instead.

1. Kronwall is a killer. Plain and simple. Like Scott Stevens. You had better know when he is on the ice and keep your head up. Borderline hits? The puck was 3" away from Havlats feet. Pretty much possesion right there.


2. The only reason he hits heads is because the "hitee" is skating with their heads down. If it was possible to skate with your head down but have it behind you then I guess he would be hitting shoulder to chest or whatever they are leading with. Followed through with the elbow? Look at that replay again and tell me he lifts that elbow more that 4-5". Its not like it ended up above his shoulder.


3. I am 100% positive he tried to hit him. Hurt him, you betcha. That is why you hit people. Its not figure skating out there.


4. It sure looks like Selanne sees him and doesnt veer away. I guess Nicky could have backed off, but really, who wants to see that.




In no way do I like to see guys laying on the ice ala Lindros, Havlat, Toews, ect, ect. But I hate pansy no hitting hockey even more. If you make it illegal to hit a players head then you will have guys skating around with their heads down all the time. Making it impossible to hit them. What is the first rule you learn when you enter minor hockey? KEEP YOUR HEAD UP! Not only to avoid being killed but to be able to see the play and make passes. Its the most fundamental rule and when you forget it, you get punished.

 

[SkyFire47]

so a player who isn't expecting to be hit is no longer allowed to be hit?