We have a new Card Grader joining the mix

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webottew

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Not really a "new" grading company -- but new to Trading Card grading.

CGC (the main comic grader) is diving into trading cards with accepting Pokemon and Magic cards first -- then sports cards in near future. I am not too familiar with CGC grading in general, but if they are accurate and can provide good turnarounds, they may challenge PSA and BGS for sports cards.

The one value add I see in their announcement is:
Once encapsulated, cards are then imaged in high-resolution. The images, along with certification details, are available at no charge in a searchable database.

If these searches are open (not just by Cert#), then these images may assist with allegations of trimmed/altered cards.

Here are some links of interest:
Sports Collectors Daily coverage
CGC official announcement
And if you are looking to become a card grader, they are hiring... CGC hiring sports card experts

Any thoughts of the potential of CGC grading cards?
 
Good news. Hopefully they will move grading forward from a tech perspective. The existing companies are pretty low tech.
 
japhi said:
Good news. Hopefully they will move grading forward from a tech perspective. The existing companies are pretty low tech.
Click to expand...

This is by design. If grading is subjective, you always have an incentive to crack and re-sub to try and get a better grade.
 
I know little about comics, so I'm only going on what I've heard from others (I have a couple of friends who are very into them). When the process of grading a comic, and what it costs, was explained to me - the entire thing (and this was specifically CGC, not sure if there's other competition?) sounds like one big pyramid scheme.

Note: Once upon a time a had considered submitting cards to be authenticated by PSA (autographs). When I discovered that Wayne Gretzky costs more to authenticate than, say, Mike Comrie - I also question that system. Of course the Gretzky is worth more, but the authentication / slabbing process is identical. The difference in price (to me) infers that they're not just selling a service (slabbing, authentication) but they're also selling "value".

So that was the thing with CGC and their grading. As I've been writing this, it actually occurs to me that this might only apply to comics of a certain vintage. Not sure.

1. Much like Beckett, they're also most trusted price guide.
2. They list prices for what a particular Comic is worth, by grade
3. The cost to grade the comic is based on the book value (a percentage)

Now, again, I'm thinking this only applied to older books (1970s & back) - but a 9.2 would be considerably more valuable than an 8.5, from my understanding. Even the difference between a 9.2 and a 9.4 could be quite dramatic.

But if the cost to grade that comic is based on the final value of the comic: Is it not in CGC's best interest to give you a higher grade, and list high prices for graded comics?


Now again, I don't know the comic industry well at all. Never read the things as a kid, and have no interest in collecting them today. Maybe I'm missing something here. Of course I will admit that I find it hard to believe that a large company (CGC) that has the vast majority of the market (price guide, grading) would risk that by intentionally giving flase grades, or jacking up prices just to improve their bottom line.... but there's just so many aspects of that business model that scream "conflict of interest".
 
30ranfordfan said:
I know little about comics, so I'm only going on what I've heard from others (I have a couple of friends who are very into them). When the process of grading a comic, and what it costs, was explained to me - the entire thing (and this was specifically CGC, not sure if there's other competition?) sounds like one big pyramid scheme.

Note: Once upon a time a had considered submitting cards to be authenticated by PSA (autographs). When I discovered that Wayne Gretzky costs more to authenticate than, say, Mike Comrie - I also question that system. Of course the Gretzky is worth more, but the authentication / slabbing process is identical. The difference in price (to me) infers that they're not just selling a service (slabbing, authentication) but they're also selling "value".

So that was the thing with CGC and their grading. As I've been writing this, it actually occurs to me that this might only apply to comics of a certain vintage. Not sure.

1. Much like Beckett, they're also most trusted price guide.
2. They list prices for what a particular Comic is worth, by grade
3. The cost to grade the comic is based on the book value (a percentage)

Now, again, I'm thinking this only applied to older books (1970s & back) - but a 9.2 would be considerably more valuable than an 8.5, from my understanding. Even the difference between a 9.2 and a 9.4 could be quite dramatic.

But if the cost to grade that comic is based on the final value of the comic: Is it not in CGC's best interest to give you a higher grade, and list high prices for graded comics?


Now again, I don't know the comic industry well at all. Never read the things as a kid, and have no interest in collecting them today. Maybe I'm missing something here. Of course I will admit that I find it hard to believe that a large company (CGC) that has the vast majority of the market (price guide, grading) would risk that by intentionally giving flase grades, or jacking up prices just to improve their bottom line.... but there's just so many aspects of that business model that scream "conflict of interest".
Click to expand...

Grading is a scheme? No way! Haha.
 
I am intrigued for sure, but I want to see what their pricing system is like.
I’m not so sure about the slabs at first glance, but I do like the grading process and technology they will be implementing.
One thing is for certain, they will give PSA and BGS a real new competitor, and from what I read in this article, appears CGC are sick of the corruption in the hobby and want to make a change that ultimately benefits us the collector.

I would love to work for them as a grader as it sounds like a great opportunity...although I live in Canada and there are better people out there to fill those shoes.
Someone with physical grading experience is obviously the best choice if they want to live up to the expectations they are presenting.
 
30ranfordfan said:
I know little about comics, so I'm only going on what I've heard from others (I have a couple of friends who are very into them). When the process of grading a comic, and what it costs, was explained to me - the entire thing (and this was specifically CGC, not sure if there's other competition?) sounds like one big pyramid scheme.

Note: Once upon a time a had considered submitting cards to be authenticated by PSA (autographs). When I discovered that Wayne Gretzky costs more to authenticate than, say, Mike Comrie - I also question that system. Of course the Gretzky is worth more, but the authentication / slabbing process is identical. The difference in price (to me) infers that they're not just selling a service (slabbing, authentication) but they're also selling "value".

So that was the thing with CGC and their grading. As I've been writing this, it actually occurs to me that this might only apply to comics of a certain vintage. Not sure.

1. Much like Beckett, they're also most trusted price guide.
2. They list prices for what a particular Comic is worth, by grade
3. The cost to grade the comic is based on the book value (a percentage)

Now, again, I'm thinking this only applied to older books (1970s & back) - but a 9.2 would be considerably more valuable than an 8.5, from my understanding. Even the difference between a 9.2 and a 9.4 could be quite dramatic.

But if the cost to grade that comic is based on the final value of the comic: Is it not in CGC's best interest to give you a higher grade, and list high prices for graded comics?


Now again, I don't know the comic industry well at all. Never read the things as a kid, and have no interest in collecting them today. Maybe I'm missing something here. Of course I will admit that I find it hard to believe that a large company (CGC) that has the vast majority of the market (price guide, grading) would risk that by intentionally giving flase grades, or jacking up prices just to improve their bottom line.... but there's just so many aspects of that business model that scream "conflict of interest".
Click to expand...

Not sure how active your friends are or perhaps something was lost in translation but there is no difference in cost between the actual grade (ex. 9.2 vs 9.4).

They basically subset them into 2 tiers which essentially equate to moderns vs vintage.

Moderns, of course, require very little actual grading as most are 9.0-9.8 straight from factory. Vintage requires a lot more inspection

Thats basically it in a nutshell.
 
I wonder how they plan on handling the scale needed for sports card grading. From what I've read they're not the quickest when it comes to turnaround times in the comics segment as it is and when you look around the big three graders in sports (BGS/PSA/SGC) they are all overhwhelmed with unprecedented backlogs right now.

Even when SGC was the only one open for business at one point during the pandemic they boasted about their quick turnaround times and immediately got buried in submissions to the point they're now a few months behind just like the other guys. They lost their advantage in the span of a few short months because they couldn't scale fast enough.

Maybe CGC can help take some of the strain off of the other companies and everything can start to balance out again. It might be tough to break in though if demand is too high right out of the gate. SGC has been around since 1998 and they couldn't even handle the sudden demand. Might be tough for a new guy to hit the ground running in the US market.

For those who are familiar with the comics scene: what kind of volume do you think CGC deals with in comics? Is it a bigger or smaller market than sports cards? I'm curious to learn more about it.
 
DredJAw said:
Not sure how active your friends are or perhaps something was lost in translation but there is no difference in cost between the actual grade (ex. 9.2 vs 9.4).

They basically subset them into 2 tiers which essentially equate to moderns vs vintage.

Moderns, of course, require very little actual grading as most are 9.0-9.8 straight from factory. Vintage requires a lot more inspection

Thats basically it in a nutshell.
Click to expand...

I did go take a look at their site. Found this page:

https://www.cgccomics.com/submit/services-fees/cgc-grading/

First line is Modern, 1975 to current, and applies to comics valued at $200 or less. Value is the next line. It costs $7 more, but I suspect this is what you pay for a pre-1975 comic.

I assume as you get into the Economy, Standard, and Express: Age does not matter. The cost is based on the book value.

So, this reads to me like a comic that is worth between $1000 and $3000 will cost you $100 to grade, but a comic worth $800 would only cost $65.

Then the Walktrhough pricing kicks in. This is for comics worth more than $3k. The service is much quicker, same day grading, but it looks like they charge you 3% of the value.

So, that is just for the big ticket items, but if a 9.2 and 9.4 are significantly different in value, then that 3% is going to add up.
 
Glad they are making the jump to cards. I really like the graded image database that they'll be creating when it comes to their cards and I hope that that practice becomes an industry standard.
 
DredJAw said:
Not sure how active your friends are or perhaps something was lost in translation but there is no difference in cost between the actual grade (ex. 9.2 vs 9.4).

They basically subset them into 2 tiers which essentially equate to moderns vs vintage.

Moderns, of course, require very little actual grading as most are 9.0-9.8 straight from factory. Vintage requires a lot more inspection

Thats basically it in a nutshell.
Click to expand...

I did go take a look at their site. Found this page:

https://www.cgccomics.com/submit/services-fees/cgc-grading/

First line is Modern, 1975 to current, and applies to comics valued at $200 or less. Value is the next line. It costs $7 more, but I suspect this is what you pay for a pre-1975 comic.

I assume as you get into the Economy, Standard, and Express: Age does not matter. The cost is based on the book value.

So, this reads to me like a comic that is worth between $1000 and $3000 will cost you $100 to grade, but a comic worth $800 would only cost $65.

Then the Walktrhough pricing kicks in. This is for comics worth more than $3k. The service is much quicker, same day grading, but it looks like they charge you 3% of the value.

So, that is just for the big ticket items, but if a 9.2 and 9.4 are significantly different in value, then that 3% is going to add up.
 
If they can take all of the things that PSA and BGS do incorrectly and improve on those areas, there's no reason they can't take a chunk of the market from them.

Of the many improvements they can do, I'd LOVE to see someone open an office in Canada to handle Canadian orders. They'd make an absolute fortune up here, with no legit viable options available other than submitting yourself ( or using the great services that Grosnor or Len Pottie offer).
 
What are people’s thoughts about MNT? I know I’ve been thinking about grading some cards of mine and a Canadian company seemed like a good idea, but seems like they aren’t that reputable yet? Are they just not established or are people just so used to just using Beckett and PSA they don’t want to change?
 
flamesfan1216 said:
What are people’s thoughts about MNT? I know I’ve been thinking about grading some cards of mine and a Canadian company seemed like a good idea, but seems like they aren’t that reputable yet? Are they just not established or are people just so used to just using Beckett and PSA they don’t want to change?
Click to expand...


All these are enough to make it An insurmountable hill. If you care about being able to sell an item, psa and bgs (and to a lesser extent sgc) are the only options. If you care about security of your card, mnt might be a viable option for we Canadians. I haven’t checked but I will assume if you go look for any card in any grade that mnt has sold, it will be lower than similar psa or bgs. This comic grading company has a chance as they already have a lot of history in the grading business.


My 2 cents

Pacman
 
flamesfan1216 said:
What are people’s thoughts about MNT? I know I’ve been thinking about grading some cards of mine and a Canadian company seemed like a good idea, but seems like they aren’t that reputable yet? Are they just not established or are people just so used to just using Beckett and PSA they don’t want to change?
Click to expand...

MNT and KSA are in a bad spot because even if the Canadian market were to accept them, the US market never will.

I do like MNTs holders (very BGS-like) but I'd rather wait out the grading process with PSA and BGS (or CGC when that happens) because I know that'll get me the most return on investment.
 
I have a PC card out to MNT currently, a bit of a test run to see if they will give it a tough and fair grade. It's got some subtle flaws that I know are there and should hold the card to a 9 at the most. If the grade is accurate and fair I'll consider sending a couple more of my PC cards in as I'm going pretty much all graded now.

In a perfect world I'd send everything to BGS or PSA, but the thought of paying all that money in fees, shipping, exchange, and customs duty on the way back just to have some of my best PC cards tied up in another country for months and months at a time... It's a lot to ask. And things have only been getting worse instead of better.

I really want to see a Canadian company make a name for themselves and succeed so we can have an option up here. The only way that reputation can be built is if people give them the chance to prove it.
 
FrozenInferno said:
I have a PC card out to MNT currently, a bit of a test run to see if they will give it a tough and fair grade. It's got some subtle flaws that I know are there and should hold the card to a 9 at the most. If the grade is accurate and fair I'll consider sending a couple more of my PC cards in as I'm going pretty much all graded now.

In a perfect world I'd send everything to BGS or PSA, but the thought of paying all that money in fees, shipping, exchange, and customs duty on the way back just to have some of my best PC cards tied up in another country for months and months at a time... It's a lot to ask. And things have only been getting worse instead of better.

I really want to see a Canadian company make a name for themselves and succeed so we can have an option up here. The only way that reputation can be built is if people give them the chance to prove it.
Click to expand...

Len Pottie is in NS and I HIGHLY recommend using his service for PSA.

[email protected]
 

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