Will the NHL ever introduce the Bobby Orr Trophy?

[jmatchett]

Or whatever the "Best Offensive Defenseman" trophy should be called? No offense to Mike Green, but he was not a "best defenseman" nominee, to me, in the traditional sense. The other options were better defensively. He has the rare ability to be able to join the rush, be involved in an offensive chance, and get back in time. But once back, he's an above-average defenseman, and any team would love to have him. But, his defensive game compared to guys like Chara and Lidstrom isn't even close. This leads me to believe that the NHL DESPERATELY needs the defenseman's version of the Selke, to praise defensemen who excel at the offensive aspect of the game. While I'd agree that there shouldn't be trophies for the sake of trophies, I'd really like to see this one because I am not a fan of highly-skilled offensive players getting nominated for the Norris when their top priority, as defenseman, should be to shut down the opposition, not to score goals (not to say that's a bad addition). End rant.

 

[mrconie]

Well they do have the Selke for best defensive forward, why not the "Orr" for best offensive defenseman. Good idea!

 

[habsheaven]

We already have an award for "Best Offensive defenseman" it's called the NORRIS TROPHY. And IMO, it should stay that way.

 

[sprague11]

We already have an award for "Best Offensive defenseman" it's called the NORRIS TROPHY. And IMO, it should stay that way.

"I Disagree!"

 

[habsheaven]

Langway was a fluke. The voters briefly came to their senses for a couple of years. Look at the rest of the list of winners. A virtual who's who of top scoring defensemen.

 

[marvelman55]

Playing offense is a key part of being a complete d-man. You can't honestly say that the Norris recognizes the best "offensive" d-man when Green didn't win last year. Gonchar has never won, and he led all d-men in scoring a few times. It almost always goes to a complete d-man. Bourque, Lidstrom, Chara, these are all guys who are reliable in their own zone, and can help out offensively. I do remember a number of players who were not good defensively getting nominated for the award though, how about Chelios, he had horrid numbers the last year he was nominated. Same with Scott Stevens, but, they were so good defensively that they deserved the nomination. I don't think saying the Norris is for best offensive defenseman is a really fair statement.

On the other hand, I don't want to see a "best offensive defenseman" award, why not give out a best defensive d-man and best offensive forward award too? How long until we get a best passing goalie award or something.

 

[jmatchett]

Well, that's why I said that I know we need to draw a line somewhere. But if there is an award that rewards defensive play in forwards, why not one for offensive play by defensemen? I'll agree that a guy who's a marginal point producer shouldn't win a Norris based SOLELY on defensive play, but a defenseman's job, first and foremost, is the be good at playing defense. I'm just using Mike green's nomination for the Norris as an example of a guy who's fine defensively, just not a GREAT defenseman.

 

[langway05]

We already have an award for "Best Offensive defenseman" it's called the NORRIS TROPHY. And IMO, it should stay that way.

"I Disagree!"

Langway was a fluke. The voters briefly came to their senses for a couple of years. Look at the rest of the list of winners. A virtual who's who of top scoring defensemen.

Alright them's almost fighting words..... :badmood: lol

Anyways, the Norris Trophy should be for the Best Defenseman. If the league were to institute the 'Bobby Orr' Trophy? Then that should be for the 'Best Offensive Defenseman'.

Lastly if I remember correctly, there is another very similar thread to this from last year, or was it from the year before!

 

[sprague11]

Orr Trophy = leading scorer among defencemen. That ain't half bad!

 

[Big Tall]

It almost always goes to a complete d-man. Bourque, Lidstrom, Chara, these are all guys who are reliable in their own zone, and can help out offensively.

Can "help out" offensively? Have you ever watched how lost the PP for Detroit or Boston is when Lidstrom or Chara aren't on the ice. It's night and day.

 

[Metrags]

"defense player who demonstrates throughout the season the greatest all-round ability in the position"

It almost always goes to the leading scorer however. Not saying it is right, but thats what it is. Just like how the Hart almost always goes to the Art Ross winner even though they are not necessarily the most valuable player.

 

[theslurpee]

It's a great idea, but instead of the Orr trophy it should be called the Coffey trophy if we are talking about the best offensive defenceman......

 

[chemicalstylez]

Yea Gonchar hasn't won and he lead like 2 or 3 times....

Its a great idea.

 

[Orca Pod]

It's a great idea, but instead of the Orr trophy it should be called the Coffey trophy if we are talking about the best offensive defenceman......

Just curious. How old are you?

 

[Big Tall]

It's a great idea, but instead of the Orr trophy it should be called the Coffey trophy if we are talking about the best offensive defenceman......

...what? :|:|:|

 

[newfiecomicguy1]

There are enough trophies now....too many.

 

[theslurpee]

Just curious. How old are you?

haha, great question. I am 36, and a little biased beause I grew up in Edmonton when Coffey was playing.

I had a look at the stats though, Coffey is second in points only to Ray Bourque who played over 200 more games than Coffey. Bobby Orr was an incredible player whose career was cut short, but we're not talking couldashouldawouldas, we're talking stats.

Besides, don't take my word for it, just ask a player named Wayne who said Coffey is the best offensive defenceman to ever play the game.

matt

 

[TanguayFan]

I kind of agree with theslurpee. Orr was almost as good defensively as he was offensively. Nobody would ever mistake Coffey for a shut down d-man. He was a 4th forward out there, pure offense from the back end. If we were going to have an offensive d-man award, why not name it after the most pure offensive d-man of the last 50 years, perhaps ever?

But does anybody else besides me see the irony of awarding a trophy named after somebody who regularly scored 100+ points and giving it to a player who might win with 45 points? LOL

 

[Orca Pod]

I had a look at the stats though... but we're not talking couldashouldawouldas, we're talking stats...

If you only want to talk stats, here's a few for you...

Norris Trophies: Orr 8, Coffey 3
Hart Trophies: Orr 3, Coffey 0
Art Ross Trophies: Orr 2, Coffey 0
Points per game average, career: Orr 1.3927, Coffey 1.0866
Goals per game average, career: Orr .411, Coffey .2811
Assists per game average, career: Orr .9817, Coffey .8055
Points per game average, career, playoffs: Orr 1.2432, Coffey 1.0103

I think the picture is becoming fairly clear by now...

Besides, don't take my word for it, just ask a player named Wayne who said Coffey is the best offensive defenceman to ever play the game.

Number of games Wayne Gretzky played with or against Bobby Orr in order to make this statement: Zero (ya, I didn't play any games against either one, but am old enough to have watched both of them and understood what was going on in a game.)

Hey Matt, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but if you want to bring up stats, the ones above should be the proof positive. Don't get me wrong, Coffey was a great offensive defenceman, I loved watching him, and would rank him in a three-way tie with Potvin and Bourque. But, this bunch is so far behind Orr it should not even be debatable.

:beer:

 

[canucksfreak19]

If you only want to talk stats, here's a few for you...

Norris Trophies: Orr 8, Coffey 3
Hart Trophies: Orr 3, Coffey 0
Art Ross Trophies: Orr 2, Coffey 0
Points per game average, career: Orr 1.3927, Coffey 1.0866
Goals per game average, career: Orr .411, Coffey .2811
Assists per game average, career: Orr .9817, Coffey .8055
Points per game average, career, playoffs: Orr 1.2432, Coffey 1.0103

I think the picture is becoming fairly clear by now...



Number of games Wayne Gretzky played with or against Bobby Orr in order to make this statement: Zero (ya, I didn't play any games against either one, but am old enough to have watched both of them and understood what was going on in a game.)

Hey Matt, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but if you want to bring up stats, the ones above should be the proof positive. Don't get me wrong, Coffey was a great offensive defenceman, I loved watching him, and would rank him in a three-way tie with Potvin and Bourque. But, this bunch is so far behind Orr it should not even be debatable.

:beer:

I believe you just got Lawyered.