steen101984
Verified Trader
its not the fifth plate its the fifth and sixth that i have. I have 2 extra plates also if i had of known they were out of 2 or 3 or 4 i wouldnt have spent what i spent on them. Who's fault is that?
One-of-One? I Don't Think So!
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its not the fifth plate its the fifth and sixth that i have. I have 2 extra plates also if i had of known they were out of 2 or 3 or 4 i wouldnt have spent what i spent on them. Who's fault is that?
steen101984
Verified Trader
Ive honestly never even heard about them until this week. Maybe up here we dont have them and thats why i hadnt heard of them but they definitely cant do much
SkyFire47
Verified Trader
UD's and they're trying to make up for it. i'm not siding with UD in saying they're not responsible. they are and should be held accountable since mistakes do happen. what i'm saying is you only have a problem with 2 of your 6 plates. not all 6 of them. no one forced you to collect and no one forced you to buy the extra 2. (which i actually think is quite cool)
honestly, your collection is more unique than the guy with 5 plates and everyone else with 4 plates. it's already quite the accomplishment to say you have all the plates but you have the error plates as well. it'd be even cooler if you had the base, exclusives, and HGs to go with them.
as someone who has also exhaustingly put an entire set together, i can appreciate the quality of your collecting. here's mine:
and yes, if an error plate did come out, i'd snatch it up and add it to these.
steen101984
Verified Trader
UD's and they're trying to make up for it. i'm not siding with UD in saying they're not responsible. they are and should be held accountable since mistakes do happen. what i'm saying is you only have a problem with 2 of your 6 plates. not all 6 of them. no one forced you to collect and no one forced you to buy the extra 2. (which i actually think is quite cool)
honestly, your collection is more unique than the guy with 5 plates and everyone else with 4 plates. it's already quite the accomplishment to say you have all the plates but you have the error plates as well. it'd be even cooler if you had the base, exclusives, and HGs to go with them.
as someone who has also exhaustingly put an entire set together, i can appreciate the quality of your collecting. here's mine:
and yes, if an error plate did come out, i'd snatch it up and add it to these.
i actually do have the base (yg) , yg exclusive (x2) and High Gloss YG as well as both colors of jersey for the rookie materials set and the rookie materials patch as well. I actually only need 2 cards to have every card of his ever printed. plus 8 1/1's
thats actually what makes me more mad because i thought i was the only one to have these cards but maybe not
pathshot
Verified Trader,
If you want to make your message a little louder, try to sell them for $5000 on eBay with free shipping, mark them as 1/1s, then put a similar diatribe in the product description.
It'll certainly help get the visibility you need.
To be fair, the Topps Finest issue was mentioned, and even ITG has had their issues with multiple 1/1s - here: http://www.itgtradingcards.com/president2.html. That said, we're human, we'll make mistakes. It's how Upper Deck handles them which has upset many of us.
-Michael
It'll certainly help get the visibility you need.
To be fair, the Topps Finest issue was mentioned, and even ITG has had their issues with multiple 1/1s - here: http://www.itgtradingcards.com/president2.html. That said, we're human, we'll make mistakes. It's how Upper Deck handles them which has upset many of us.
-Michael
steen101984
Verified Trader
honestly very well put and thats what im trying to convey is that they should live up to their mistakes and not sweep them under the rug. (also not a bad idea)
samiaa
No Trade Group!
Very nicely said, it all comes down to handling those mistake situations.
lawbick
Verified Trader
I don't think jurisdiction would be an issue.
Tread very carefully. Costs can be awarded in "small claims" court. In Alberta, the Provincial Court - Civil Division is our "small claims" court and generally has jurisdiction over claims with a value less than $25,000. Costs are discretionary and are usually awarded to the 'winner'. The custom is 10% of the value of the claim, but since costs are discretionary, the Court can (and has) gone so far as to award solicitor and client costs on a full indemnity basis against the losing party (which means the loser must pay the winner's legal bill).
Hurt feelings are not compensable. Further, attempts to resolve the matter are relevant and will be assessed by the Court. Was the offer reasonable? Was refusing to accept a reasonable offer reasonable in the circumstances?
DO NOT HANG YOURSELF ON PRINCIPLE. In first year law they tell you "when a client tells you 'it's about the principle of the thing', you know you just doubled your fees". I will not express an opinion one way or the other about UD or your problem, but I will tell you that you need to make a reasonable assessment of your damages (what has this actually cost you?) and a reasonable assessment of their offers (does it come close to covering what you actually have lost?).
BIG COMPANIES DO NOT SIMPLY IGNORE OR PAY OUT SMALL CLAIMS BECAUSE THEY ARE BIG COMPANIES. Companies will pay their lawyers thousands of dollars to avoid paying a $200 claim. Why? Risk management sometimes leads you to conclude that paying a claim will produce a better and more certain outcome than litigating it. The other side of this coin is that there is a greater risk in settling, thus setting a precedent, than in taking your chances in Court.
DogfoodSoup
Verified Trader
I really enjoy when you post about legal issues on the forums. You somehow manage to turn law-speak in to english, and since I can almost understand english it's much easier on my brain.
lawbick
Verified Trader
DogfoodSoup
Verified Trader
Then I'll send you my bill instead of Bruce
Yes, please do continue to send the bill to Bruce.
g-force
Verified Trader , 2010 Hobby Insider Fantasy Footb
I would generally agree with this advice as well. I will not divulge into Alberta law, as it is a different system than that which I am used to in Saskatchewan. However, where I think the OP needs to give some strong consideration to is what the actual, provable damages are that have been suffered. If you're going to court, not only do you need to show you are right, you also have to established what loss you have actually incurred (usually a $ amount).
webottew
Verified Trader,
I think the BBB is mostly a mediator to try to work out conflicts (although they really have no teeth to enforce anything), and their ratings are designed to be used by customers BEFORE they deal with a company. For instance, before hiring a contractor to put a new roof on my house, I checked with the local BBB to see what type of rating they had and the number & nature of any complaints. If the roofing contractor had an F rating, I wouldn't have dealt with them...
lawbick
Verified Trader
In Alberta we have the Fair Trading Act, found here:
http://www.qp.alberta.ca/574.cfm?page=F02.cfm&leg_type=Acts&isbncln=9780779737963
If there is similar legislation in your jurisdiction, you could look to it to see if it helps you. I'm not saying it would help you here in Alberta, but it is a start.
http://www.qp.alberta.ca/574.cfm?page=F02.cfm&leg_type=Acts&isbncln=9780779737963
If there is similar legislation in your jurisdiction, you could look to it to see if it helps you. I'm not saying it would help you here in Alberta, but it is a start.
steen101984
Verified Trader
thank you for the free legal advice it is appreciated im not sure how exactly this can be resolved through the court system and will have to look into it in my area (ontario) but that gives me a decent idea on how to go about it
Burner
Verified Trader,
I have a feeling that unless you have a receipt from your purchases, you're going to be out of luck in court
steen101984
Verified Trader
of the purchases only one was actually made with a receipt one was made on SCF and one was made in person at the expo from a guy on SCF. So literally no chance of receipts. To be honest you may be right on that topic as well.
D
domhas1
Guest
Do you have any old paypal payment sheets for the others?
fly4apuckguy
Registered Trader
Interesting read. I actually went from post one to the end, and I think I flipped back and forth ten times on what I think is the "right" thing to do.
I just want to say I appreciate what steen101984 is trying to accomplish. I think a lot of people might be missing his point somewhat, in that it is not simply an issue regarding compensation for a loss, it is also about how a company treats its customers.
In a perfect world, Upper Deck would be appreciative of us, the collectors, and in essence feel the need to bend over backwards to ensure that we are and remain satisfied customers.
If this issue had been met with a sincere apology and heartfelt contrition, I am guessing steen101984 takes his compensation, with some reservations, and moves on. However, instead of taking that path, UD acts impersonally, and offers compensation with a "take it and shut up" type of attitude.
Like I said, I see why steen101984 is choosing to push this a bit. If nothing else, it might make one of the talking heads stop and realize that we are not just a bunch of cardboard addicts willing to bend over and receive what we are delivered simply because we have no other choice.
Maybe it will force them to acknowledge that they need us more than we need them. I suspect this truth is lost on a lot of them. We can all walk away from this hobby tomorrow and continue with our daily lives. UD can't operate that way.
A little acknowledgement of that would be a good way of running a business, and make your customers loyal, as opposed to litigious.
I say well done, but make sure you don't put yourself in a spot where the big company can hurt you financially. It is a point worth making, but not at the expense of your own bank account or emotional well-being.
I just want to say I appreciate what steen101984 is trying to accomplish. I think a lot of people might be missing his point somewhat, in that it is not simply an issue regarding compensation for a loss, it is also about how a company treats its customers.
In a perfect world, Upper Deck would be appreciative of us, the collectors, and in essence feel the need to bend over backwards to ensure that we are and remain satisfied customers.
If this issue had been met with a sincere apology and heartfelt contrition, I am guessing steen101984 takes his compensation, with some reservations, and moves on. However, instead of taking that path, UD acts impersonally, and offers compensation with a "take it and shut up" type of attitude.
Like I said, I see why steen101984 is choosing to push this a bit. If nothing else, it might make one of the talking heads stop and realize that we are not just a bunch of cardboard addicts willing to bend over and receive what we are delivered simply because we have no other choice.
Maybe it will force them to acknowledge that they need us more than we need them. I suspect this truth is lost on a lot of them. We can all walk away from this hobby tomorrow and continue with our daily lives. UD can't operate that way.
A little acknowledgement of that would be a good way of running a business, and make your customers loyal, as opposed to litigious.
I say well done, but make sure you don't put yourself in a spot where the big company can hurt you financially. It is a point worth making, but not at the expense of your own bank account or emotional well-being.
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I cant ignore this anymore. Your being completely unreasonable. in one post, you complain about losing your job and being ripped off in a box of Hockey cards, and another you say you should be compensated for the $1000 you spent on 6 plates.
1., if you have money problems, you shoudlnt be buyign hockey cards. If you dont liek what Upper deck puts out, Dont buy it. Buy Singles, oir buy stock, or go to the casino.
2. Upper Deck has NO OBLIGATION to you for anythign other then the erorr plates, which they offered to you in the form of $80 boxes. I fele its fair, but you say its not, and then they offered even more. For one plate of an average player, thats a great deal. What do you want? Your not going to get Richard MacMillian to come to your house and wipe your ***, so stop trying. you dont like the state of thew hobby, then leave. No one forces you to do this, it is not a NECESSITY!
Your coming off as someone that wants either the world or a Sidney Crosby CUP Rookie Card for this small mistake. And in this very rare instance, YOU are wrong here, not UD.
I had to get that off my chest.
1., if you have money problems, you shoudlnt be buyign hockey cards. If you dont liek what Upper deck puts out, Dont buy it. Buy Singles, oir buy stock, or go to the casino.
2. Upper Deck has NO OBLIGATION to you for anythign other then the erorr plates, which they offered to you in the form of $80 boxes. I fele its fair, but you say its not, and then they offered even more. For one plate of an average player, thats a great deal. What do you want? Your not going to get Richard MacMillian to come to your house and wipe your ***, so stop trying. you dont like the state of thew hobby, then leave. No one forces you to do this, it is not a NECESSITY!
Your coming off as someone that wants either the world or a Sidney Crosby CUP Rookie Card for this small mistake. And in this very rare instance, YOU are wrong here, not UD.
I had to get that off my chest.
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