frankiefives
Verified Trader,
By the way, I'm not saying the deals I mentioned will actually happen. I'm saying Howson won't get anything MORE than that from any team. Would I want Ottawa to trade say Turris, Lehner and a 1st? No freaking way.
trade deadline just got more interestin, Rick Nash available
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gretzky99
Guest
totally agree. Nash is a very good forward that is an excellent goal scorer. but he is way overpaid. to give up 3 highly talented players all under the age of 25 AND have to pay that crazy salary is asinine.
i don't blame Howson for asking, but if any GM gives up that much for Nash and his bloated contract, they deserve the next 6 years of mediocrity they have coming to them.
newfiecomicguy1
Transactions, Hockey & Comic Book Moderator, April
However there is nothing wrong with setting the bar high. At least then when teams try to wheel and deal you can drop a little to make the deal happen and still do really well. Howson knows exactly what he is doing and setting it high won't scare away NHL Gms, they know the game. I don't think for one minute that Howson thinks he will get all that for Nash. I think he is fishing, testing the waters.
plubers
Verified Trader,
JJ a top pairing? In the AHL maybe. It's no coincidence he leads the team in the minus stat yet again. He has alright offense but he still has issues in his own end. He may have more goals than Doughty but Doughty schools him in the defensive zone. Please trade him Deno!
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gretzky99
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alright offense? really? he has twice as many goals as Doughty.
and it's not like Doughty is killing the +/- either. he's even. not to mention all the penalties Doughty takes. if you count all the PP goals the Kings give up with Doughty in the box he is at least a -10.
defense is more than +/-. Doughty has more than 2X the PIMs in less games, all minors.
Johnson has 4 GWGs as well.
oh yeah, and Doughty makes almost $3M/year more.
Trade Doughty.
Metrags
Registered Member
Nash is terribly offensive minded. The difference between him and Kovalchuk is that Nash is also a leader on and off the ice. Take that away and all you are left with is Dany Heatley (I know every one is like "who's that?")
He is not worth the contract, and the Rags already have 2 big money forwards. I would rather we didnt go after him personally, but I wouldnt complain if we did as long as the 'price' was right.
Right now the asking price is way too high, and we aren't in much of a need for him.
He is not worth the contract, and the Rags already have 2 big money forwards. I would rather we didnt go after him personally, but I wouldnt complain if we did as long as the 'price' was right.
Right now the asking price is way too high, and we aren't in much of a need for him.
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gretzky99
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yes - exactly
canucksfreak19
Verified Trader,
Regardless of how good Nash is or isn't he has way more than 3 good years left. I think players like Jarome Iginla would take umbrage with the type of thinking that states anyone over the age of 31 is on the decline.
CGS28
Verified Trader
I realize that is what the public statements have been, but I kinda wonder if that is really the way it happened. He made statements more than a month ago that if the team asked he would not let his no trade clause stand in the way of moving him. He kept saying that he would not request the trade, but I just kinda wonder if it's a way for the team to keep him looking like a good guy rather than the guy asking to get out of here.
If Nash and Carter are so great, then why trade either of them? okay if they can't play on the same line, then that makes for a pretty good starting point for the top two lines... And how can we tell if they can get any chemistry going as with Carters injuries they really have not been playing with consistent lines... this constant juggling and then getting rid of players every year does not lead them to getting used to playing with the same guys all the time.. oh well.. really will be intersting to see our lineup vs Detriot on 2/28...
If Nash and Carter are so great, then why trade either of them? okay if they can't play on the same line, then that makes for a pretty good starting point for the top two lines... And how can we tell if they can get any chemistry going as with Carters injuries they really have not been playing with consistent lines... this constant juggling and then getting rid of players every year does not lead them to getting used to playing with the same guys all the time.. oh well.. really will be intersting to see our lineup vs Detriot on 2/28...
punkoholic
Verified Trader
In the rumour that was reported, they also had Kings with a +, what else would they have added to that rumoured deal? A pick or a prospect? A salary dump(Penner)?
I'm glad Howson is asking for the moon. If GM's pass up and then I'm hoping Howson keeps Nash and not settle for a lower offer. Only thing is, is Nash fine with not being dealt and staying in Columbus knowing that Howson was trying to trade him?
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MMarch
One Man Wolfpack, ,
Nash is an elite talent who has played his entire career on a bad team. Is he overpaid? Maybe, but teams like Columbus have to overpay to get/keep talent like Nash around. How many players do you hear saying they will waive their no trade clause to go to Columbus? Teams trading for him know this is the case, and if they are willing to take on his contract then they feel he is worth it. Not to mention there is a minimum cap and players get more money on a team like Columbus to raise their cap floor.
Who has Nash had to work with in his career? Everyone knows when you play Columbus, you shut down Nash and you have a good chance at winning every night. He is always playing against the opposing teams top D pair and shut down forwards. And, even though he is a well paid professional athlete, it's probably difficult to get pumped up every night knowing you are on a team going nowhere. You give the guy a decent team around him and he could very easily take off like we know he is capable of.
I like JJ more then Plubers, and he is the only "cog" of those 3 players. If Columbus was willing to take JJ, Bernier, Loko, and a pick, LA would be crazy not to do it. Bernier is way over rated, there are plenty of other "backups" in the league who are light years ahead of Bernier. Loko is how far from even cracking an NHL roster, he is not doing anything for the Kings right now. The only thing LA would be giving up that they get production from on a nightly basis is JJ, Bernier doesn't help them from the bench, and Loko is a toss in that doesn't hurt them.
punkoholic
Verified Trader
I think Bob Mackenzie suggested the following and I was thinking the same thing.
He suggested Howson might deal Nash to a team not named the Kings. Once Nash is dealt, Howson would go to the Kings and dangle Carter and see if they would take him. Kind of make sense if LA was the only serious team interested in Carter. This could piss off Lombardi and he might say,"Screw you, I don't want Carter anymore" but at the same time, if he is pressured to do something, he might give in and take Carter.
He suggested Howson might deal Nash to a team not named the Kings. Once Nash is dealt, Howson would go to the Kings and dangle Carter and see if they would take him. Kind of make sense if LA was the only serious team interested in Carter. This could piss off Lombardi and he might say,"Screw you, I don't want Carter anymore" but at the same time, if he is pressured to do something, he might give in and take Carter.
Kyle
Verified Trader
He needs to continue asking for the moon and stick to it through the trade deadline. If anybody's gonna panic and pull the trigger it will be between now and Monday. If he waits until the summer he'll have more teams to work with but I doubt teams will be up against the wall like they are now heading towards the playoffs.
I'd be content for them to just get rid of Carter for now. Get as much as they can and wash their hands of him. Good riddance.
They play in the best division in the league and St. Louis and Nashville are both young and very good. Trading for a bunch of young guys scares the crap out of me because they've never been able to develop any. Other than Nash, all their picks have never panned out. So we're supposed to watch a bunch of under 25yr old's get tuned up every night for the next 3-4 years? We've done that since they came into the league.
I'm not convinced drafting Yakupov will work for them either. In fact I'm not so sure this team will ever be anything more than they are with current ownership believing Howson knows what he's doing.
I see another 4-5 years of beatings, losing, and guys unhappy.
I'd be content for them to just get rid of Carter for now. Get as much as they can and wash their hands of him. Good riddance.
They play in the best division in the league and St. Louis and Nashville are both young and very good. Trading for a bunch of young guys scares the crap out of me because they've never been able to develop any. Other than Nash, all their picks have never panned out. So we're supposed to watch a bunch of under 25yr old's get tuned up every night for the next 3-4 years? We've done that since they came into the league.
I'm not convinced drafting Yakupov will work for them either. In fact I'm not so sure this team will ever be anything more than they are with current ownership believing Howson knows what he's doing.
I see another 4-5 years of beatings, losing, and guys unhappy.
FrozenInferno
Resident Bluenoser, Verified Trader,
Reuniting Carter and Richards would be a good thing.
punkoholic
Verified Trader
Bobby Mac suggested that dealing Nash might get you a good deal now but if he waits until the Summer, the offer wouldn't be as good as it is now. But like you said, would have more teams interested.
It would be but if Lombardi thinks Howson had no plans of dealing Nash to them and was using LA to get a better offer from another team, would this anger him that he would no longer want to deal with Howson(for Carter)? Or when you're under pressure to add some scoring, you ignore what Howson did regarding the Nash situation and still make a deal with him for Carter?
canucksfreak19
Verified Trader,
For the party scene in L.A. :beer:.
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gretzky99
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i think DL is hoping Howson will crack on Nash but will probably take Carter if Bernier is going the other way.
i honestly don't think any other team will consider trading what they want for Nash. i think it's better for Columbus to keep him and trade Carter.
punkoholic
Verified Trader
I was under the impression that they would trade both Carter and Nash. But yes, imo, they should keep him. I wonder how Nash would feel though, Howson was shopping him hard and all of a sudden, we decided to keep you.
I don't think Nash will get traded with the rumoured asking price from Howson.
LA-the one you saw, Johnson,Bernier,Loktionov,+ (but apparently he doesn't really want Johnson and wants someone else?)
Philly- What was it, one of Shenn/Couturier, Bobrovsky, and JVR.
NYR-Stepen was a must
I hope Howson is seeing if anyone would offer a big package and if not, no worries, we're happy to keep him, rather then him lowering his demands. I would not be surprise if Carter is a King and Bernier is a Jacket come trade deadline, would be interesting what other pieces would be involved.
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gretzky99
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if that is the deal, i would think DL would want Columbus to take Penner and an asset (pick or Martinez) and get Sanford in return.
Penner is UFA so it's just a matter of cap space. and the Kings would need a backup for Quick if they trade Bernier.
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gretzky99
Guest
as a side note, i think the Kings could potentially pull out of the Nash sweepstakes and concentrate on Carter and JVR.
i have to think the basic trade of Bernier for Carter could go down. Columbus rids themselves of that contract and they get their #1 goalie they are looking for. and yes, Bernier is seen as a good bet to be a solid #1. that's not me saying that, that's McKenzie and others.
with JVR's contract jumping to $4M+ next year, the Flyers are going to be in some serious cap trouble. they still have to re-sign Jagr, Voracek and Carle, that's at least $15M against their cap for next year. right now they have $57M committed (that includes Pronger). so that puts them well over.
the Flyers have 9 forwards that are all top-9 worthy that will be making less than JVR next year (plus Briere who will make more). Giroux, Jagr, Schenn, Simmonds, Hartnell, Talbot, Read, Courturier and Voracek.
JVR is expendable at his price tag. the Kings could offer something like Stoll + 1st or Stoll + Voynov. Stoll helps them this year for the Cup run and Voynov could be a cheap alternative for Carle or of course they could take the 1st round pick which will likely be middle of the round.
i think JVR + Carter helps the Kings more than just Nash and they would have to give up less to get them.
PHI doesn't have to make that move now - they can wait until the summer or at the draft. but they will likely have to move a forward and JVR looks to be the most likely to go based on his contract and how the young kids have stepped up.
i have to think the basic trade of Bernier for Carter could go down. Columbus rids themselves of that contract and they get their #1 goalie they are looking for. and yes, Bernier is seen as a good bet to be a solid #1. that's not me saying that, that's McKenzie and others.
with JVR's contract jumping to $4M+ next year, the Flyers are going to be in some serious cap trouble. they still have to re-sign Jagr, Voracek and Carle, that's at least $15M against their cap for next year. right now they have $57M committed (that includes Pronger). so that puts them well over.
the Flyers have 9 forwards that are all top-9 worthy that will be making less than JVR next year (plus Briere who will make more). Giroux, Jagr, Schenn, Simmonds, Hartnell, Talbot, Read, Courturier and Voracek.
JVR is expendable at his price tag. the Kings could offer something like Stoll + 1st or Stoll + Voynov. Stoll helps them this year for the Cup run and Voynov could be a cheap alternative for Carle or of course they could take the 1st round pick which will likely be middle of the round.
i think JVR + Carter helps the Kings more than just Nash and they would have to give up less to get them.
PHI doesn't have to make that move now - they can wait until the summer or at the draft. but they will likely have to move a forward and JVR looks to be the most likely to go based on his contract and how the young kids have stepped up.
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